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IP - Analogue
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| ak357 |
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Posts: 294
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
Location: Canada
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:14 am
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| GT_Cameras wrote: |
| ak357 wrote: |
Rory would u agree that NTSC is analog system?
yes or no please 
just to help u answer
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Analogue has become industry parlance for wired cameras. We all fall into the trap and use analogue instead of wired.
In camera parlance, analogue means that the camera actually records to film. You know 35mm cameras? That is an analogue camera - you have to put film in it and change it after 24 or 36 exposures. Basically, analogue cameras work because there are three emulsion layers on film. These layers react to one of the three primary colours - the chemical structure of the emulsion layer will change according to the colour of the light actually let in.....
Digital cameras uses imaging sensors to accomplish the same thing. An imaging sensor basically detects colour and translates it into digital information on a pixel by pixel basis. |
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composite_video_signal
plz look at video signal waveform and tell me where do u see "pixels" ?
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| rory |
Moderator & Founding Member
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Posts: 14311
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Location: Bahamas
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:19 am
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| ak357 wrote: |
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"Analog (or analogue) television encodes television picture and sound information and transmits it as an analog signal, that is to say: one in which the message conveyed by the broadcast signal is a function of deliberate variations in the amplitude and/or frequency of the signal. All systems preceding digital television, such as NTSC, PAL or SECAM are analog television systems"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_television
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Composite video is the format of an analog television
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composite_video_signal
http://service.us.panasonic.com/OPERMANPDF/WVCW484.PDF
Specifications
Video output:VBS 1.0 V [P-P] NTSC composite 75 /BNC connector
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NTSC (National Television System Committee) is the analog television system used in the United States, Canada
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTSC
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Once again, it is a Transmission, the camera is STILL DIGITAL.
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BahamasSecurity.com - Bahamas Real Estate - Bahamas Yellow Pages
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| ak357 |
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Posts: 294
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
Location: Canada
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:35 am
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[quote="rory"]
| ak357 wrote: |
quote]
Once again, it is a Transmission, the camera is STILL DIGITAL. |
ok Rory I give up
We all selling digital video signal processing camera with Analog output
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| rory |
Moderator & Founding Member
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Posts: 14311
Joined: 10 Nov 2003
Location: Bahamas
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:45 am
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| ak357 wrote: |
ok Rory I give up
We all selling digital video signal processing camera with Analog output |
Yes, and Digital Recorder 
Look, Im all for higher quality, and that in the form of MegaPixel cameras (I wont mess with any basic IP cameras), but all Manufacturers, CCTV and IP cameras, need to get up to speed. The products coming from CCTV camera manufacturers these days have degraded in manufacturing quality and performance, and the IP cameras have their own list of problems, not to mention hardly any manufacturer can provide proper demos of their products short of amazing marketing hype.
Im tired ... its all a game to most manufacturers these days, and it seems its the same with the NVR and DVR's also. The industry has gone down hill over the past few years, and there are people entering it for only one reason and thats money, with little to no appreciation of the actual purpose nor the time to learn it properly, just hope it gets better and not worse as it has been.
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BahamasSecurity.com - Bahamas Real Estate - Bahamas Yellow Pages
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| GT_Cameras |
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Posts: 12
Joined: 21 Apr 2008
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:09 am
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| rory wrote: |
Im tired ... its all a game to most manufacturers these days, and it seems its the same with the NVR and DVR's also. The industry has gone down hill over the past few years, and there are people entering it for only one reason and thats money, with little to no appreciation of the actual purpose nor the time to learn it properly, just hope it gets better and not worse as it has been. |
Do you think this is because of buyers or because of sellers?
On one hand, new factories are springing up everyday and they are all pumping out thousands upon thousands of cameras everyday. Mass production equals price wars equals shoddy manufacturing. These manufacturers pump out their products at obscenely low prices, which gets mass marketing CCTV salespeople worked up in a frenzy because of high profit margins.
But, you've worked in retail. How many people have you met who don't care if their system is actually safe, they just want it to be cheap? Consequently, eCommerce enabled sites pump out thousands of cameras to people who only care about the bottom line price. Look at eBay. You can't tell me that the $8 barrel cameras are actually good quality. Yet they sell...
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| scorpion |
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Posts: 2802
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Location: Melbourne Florida
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:09 pm
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GT_Cameras I agree with you 100%!!
| Quote: |
| Do you think this is because of buyers or because of sellers? |
Both!! As buyers become more aware of the product then they will buy it. As buyers become more aware of price points then they will buy it.
As sellars try to make the investors happy, then they have to move the product as fast as they can, and keep the headroom down low, and cut out the money that should have been spent on tech support, and a help desk.
When the investors see another market that will give them the high return on investment that they look for, then they will get out of the CCTV market, and go elsewhere. Right now product went from 100s of unit sold per year to millions of units sold per year. Are we at the top of the apogee? What happens when the investors get out? Has enough research and development been accomplished to sustain the CCTV business?
Will the investors hang in there until the market becomes so oversaturated that it will cause a price crash, and high inventory levels??
I saw this with the CB market as a kid. Everyone was making CB, and everyone was selling them, and then boom!
I saw this again with the coin operated amusement machines. There was a Mrs Pac Man in every restaurant, coin laundry, and the 7-11s!
I owned 3 game rooms in the very early 80s, and I saw the writing on the wall! I closed my lowest earning place, and concentrated on my big one.
I got out of the game room business, and sold my route, and went into the icecream business. Just as the coin op crashed I was sitting pretty!
I sold the stand up games a couple of years ago, but I miss my Robotron among others!
| Quote: |
| Mass production equals price wars |
I am for that! If it was not for technology (mass production) then we would not be able to afford to drive cars! Now everyone in the US has one!
Once everyone has a system it will become a commodity just like a washer, dryer, refridgerator, and a microwave.
Can you remember when only the "rich" had microwaves??
I remember my dad when he came home with this gadget in the early 70s. He was all proud of himself because he could afford one finally! It could add, it could subtact, and it could multiply, and better yet it could divide!! Price?? $70.00 in 1972. Guess how long the batteries lasted!! LOL!!
OK. There is still a calculator market, but then again you can go to Wally World, and you can buy one for $5.00. If you are an accountant they have $300.00 units that are commercial grade, and they have printers, and other features.
When will Sears sell DVRs next to plasma, and LCD TVs??
| Quote: |
| shoddy manufacturing |
There is a sucker born every minute!
Once the consumer becomes more aware of these products then they will demand better quality! There will be a "Crazy Al's" CCTV world, and they will sell junk at cheap prices, and there will be one on every corner! Come on down to Crazy Al's CCTV World!! Come on down to CCTV King! They will be on the other side of the corner!! LOL!!
Then there will be a serious store that will advertise, promote, and they will become the defacto standard for quality DVRS. Their grandkids will still be rich long after all of us have died. DVRs will be called by that name, and they will loose the name of their business like Frisbee, and YO YO, and other names we all have become accustomed to.
| Quote: |
obscenely low prices, which gets mass marketing CCTV salespeople worked up in a frenzy because of high profit margins.
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There are no "high profit margins" when they are sold at low prices. Your profit comes from the margins. You will have to sell in volume to survive. Wally World will crush a few manufactures in the process, but everyone will have a CCTV DVR in every room!!
| Quote: |
| How many people have you met who don't care if their system is actually safe |
This is why there are recalls on baby chairs, baby cribs ect.
Well, yes of course I care for my kid, but I did not know that the crib would trap his/her head, and choke them to death? I am not a bad parent!! I am just cheap!
I use these for license plate recognition!!
LOL!
_________________
Scorpion
http://scorpiontheater.com/troubleshooting.aspx
http://scorpiontheater.com/contactus.aspx
QUESTION: Why is there always enough time to go back and fix it right a second time??
Last edited by scorpion on Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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| C7 in CA |
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Posts: 714
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Location: Nor*Cal
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:37 pm
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| scorpion wrote: |
I use these for license plate recognition!!
LOL! |
There ya go bragg'n about your high end installs again! 
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Scott
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| scorpion |
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Posts: 2802
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Location: Melbourne Florida
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Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:40 pm
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| QED |
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Posts: 8
Joined: 12 May 2008
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Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 2:24 am
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Ha ha, thanks.
Got a bit more than i bargained for when i started this thread!!!
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| QED |
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Posts: 8
Joined: 12 May 2008
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Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 2:26 am
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Thank you for your comments though very interesting.
Mixed bag which i am supprised at.
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| scorpion |
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Posts: 2802
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Location: Melbourne Florida
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Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 6:04 am
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| scorpion |
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Posts: 2802
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Location: Melbourne Florida
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Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:49 am
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| Quote: |
Once again, it is a Transmission, the camera is STILL DIGITAL.
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Ironic is it not!
We use a digital ccd to give us video, and then we use a digital to analog converter, and then we put this signal on to a cable, and then it gets to a board where we hook it up to an analog to digital converter!!!!!!!
http://www.pixim.com/products-and-technology/technology
http://www.pixim.com/assets/files/product_and_tech/Pixim_Digital_Pixel_System_Backgrounder.pdf
The core invention in the Digital Pixel System technology is the inclusion of an analog-to-digital converter (ADC) within each pixel of the image sensor. The ADC translates the light signal into a digital value at the immediate point of capture, thus minimizing signal degradation and cross-talk in the array and allowing for greater noise reduction methods. Once the data is captured in a digital format, a variety of digital signal processing techniques are used for optimal image reproduction.
http://www.gencore.co.kr/korean/more/techwell/ShortFormCatalog_Jan_2003_Rev1.pdf
The TW2804 includes four high quality NTSC/ PAL
video decoders, which convert analog composite to
digital component YCbCr for security application. The
TW280X contains four 10-bit A/D and proprietary
digital gain/clamp controllers and utilizes proprietary
techniques for separating lumin-ance & chrominance
to reduce both cross-luminance and crosschrominance
artifacts. The high performance dual
scalers in each channel offer two differently scaled
video outputs with 54MHz ITU-R BT.656 format for
security system design. Four built-in motion detectors
can also increase the feature of security system.
Both Rory, and AK357 are right!!!
_________________
Scorpion
http://scorpiontheater.com/troubleshooting.aspx
http://scorpiontheater.com/contactus.aspx
QUESTION: Why is there always enough time to go back and fix it right a second time??
Last edited by scorpion on Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:06 am; edited 2 times in total
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| rory |
Moderator & Founding Member
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Posts: 14311
Joined: 10 Nov 2003
Location: Bahamas
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Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:56 am
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