Server upgrade postponed



View unanswered posts | View active topics


Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
  
 Post subject: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:02 am 
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 9

Offline
Hello,

First post here and I am hoping others can help us out.

We are a small family company out of the Massachusetts area and have had a major problem with an HD over coax project.

The equipment we are using:
- 2 Speco analog cameras
- 2 Digital Watchdog "DWC-HV421TIR" 2.1 megapixel HD-SDI cameras
- 1 12v 8fused altronix power supply
- 1 Everfocus DVR "EDR-HD-4H4"

The Problem:
Everytime we install a digital watchdog camera (located at the driveway) into the DVR at the site it instantly disables the test monitor output and the HD-SDI output.

Our Troubleshooting:
We have replaced the camera 5 times! (same model)
We returned and replaced the DVR (same model)
We upgraded and replaced the power supply
We check continutity and power output of cabling
We checked continuity and reterminated BNCs of video cable (RG59)
Put the working digital watchdog camera on all HD DVR ports and they work

Whats working:
Both analog cameras are working
One of the digital watchdog cameras are working (side of building)
Non working digital watchdog camera shows ok green LED and IRs light up when covered
power test ok
BNC ports test ok
We had the camera plugged into the DVR at our office and it worked for three days. Once we install it at the site the video outputs of the camera go black.

the only thing different at the site is the additional 2 analog cameras and one other digital watchdig camera that is the same model.
The coax is professional siemese cable, i forget what brand or specs, but it is RG59 CL2 rated.

Any ideas?

Has anyone heard of anything like this?

Both Digital Watchdog and Everfocus have no advice.

Thanks you


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:33 am 
User avatar
Registered User

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 342
Location: the dog house

Offline
i would suspect a wiring fault of some sort, possibly a ground issue or ground loop, possibly interference on that one line, possibly even a damaged sheath on the one line that's allowing the shield to touch something it shouldn't.

have you tried connecting the "non-working" camera directly to the dvr with a short cable?

try connecting the camera to its run without actually mounting it to anything (especially if it mounts to metal)?

how about connecting an analog camera to that run and switching it to an analog input, see if the same problem arises?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:48 am 
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 9

Offline
We have connected a working analog camera to the run and it works perfect.

We connected the non working HD-SDI camera to the DVR with a short cable after it malfunctions on the field and it still does not output video, but it did at the office before installation.......same thing, all five times

I am planning on running new cable, we did test for continuity and the inner copper is not touching the copper braids until we force it to. We visually inspected the wire and it seems ok, BUT there is about five feet where a Comcast technician was working that we can’t get to unless we take the ceiling tile down (it's very tightly installed) we are going to do that next time we go back.

Is it possible the Comcast technician installed a splitter on our RG59 thinking it was TV? Would an analog camera work through a splitter and would out continuity tests work through a splitter?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:51 am 
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 9

Offline
oh, and its mounted to the on-wall exterior mount that is manufactured by Digital Watchdog for that camera. "DWC-V4WM"


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:39 pm 
User avatar
Integrator

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 6071
Location: PA

Offline
How long is the cable used with the camera your having uses with?

_________________
www.thewireguys.tv
Avigilon Enterprise Certified Solutions Provider
Genetec Certified Partner
ICT ProtegeGX Certified


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 6:44 pm 
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 9

Offline
The cable is a home run, about 30ft. 10 feet of which i have not visually inspected.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:39 am 
User avatar
Manufacturer

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 503
Location: Tustin, CA

Offline
Try using a HDCCTV compliant camera. The everfocus DVR is HDCCTV compliant but the Digital Watchdog is HD-SDI.

_________________
Vince
http://www.goldenstateinst.com


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:33 pm 
User avatar
Registered User

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 342
Location: the dog house

Offline
Mordavia wrote:
Is it possible the Comcast technician installed a splitter on our RG59 thinking it was TV? Would an analog camera work through a splitter and would out continuity tests work through a splitter?

never tried it... but it wouldn't surprise me that an analog camera would work through a catv splitter, and i would definitely expect sdi wouldn't, although i wouldn't expect to see the strange symptoms you're getting. either way, give your average catv tech, such a thing is entirely possible - you would still see proper continuity end-to-end.

too bad nobody has actually come up with an sdi cable certifier (or at least, not one that doesn't cost as much as a car) - even the hdcctv alliance's "official" recommendation for testing cable runs it to connect a camera and see if it works.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:31 am 
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 39

Offline
GrouchoBoucho wrote:
Mordavia wrote:
I

too bad nobody has actually come up with an sdi cable certifier (or at least, not one that doesn't cost as much as a car) - even the hdcctv alliance's "official" recommendation for testing cable runs it to connect a camera and see if it works.


FM Systems does.

http://www.fmsystems-inc.com/cw/Details ... ategory=16


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:05 am 
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 9

Offline
So we ran new cabling. And it worked.

I pulled the old cabling out of the ceiling/walls and the only thing I could see was a twist in the coax. Although this wire worked for regular analog cameras it did not work with the digital watchdog camera.

Do all HD-SDI cameras disable their video outputs if the coax is not perfect?

If HD over coax installations require perfect coax cabling I think we will avoid using this technology in the future. Who know what condition previously ran wire might be in.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:43 pm 
User avatar
Registered User

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 342
Location: the dog house

Offline
justincameras wrote:
GrouchoBoucho wrote:
too bad nobody has actually come up with an sdi cable certifier (or at least, not one that doesn't cost as much as a car) - even the hdcctv alliance's "official" recommendation for testing cable runs it to connect a camera and see if it works.


FM Systems does.

http://www.fmsystems-inc.com/cw/Details ... ategory=16

yeah, and i could buy a car for what it costs.

Mordavia wrote:
Do all HD-SDI cameras disable their video outputs if the coax is not perfect?

i wouldn't think so - i would just expect the signal is too degraded to be decoded properly by the dvr.

Mordavia wrote:
If HD over coax installations require perfect coax cabling I think we will avoid using this technology in the future. Who know what condition previously ran wire might be in.

yup - despite all the marketing claims of this being an easy drop-in retrofit for analog systems, the fact is, the cable *and connectors* do need to be good quality, and in good condition. as you've found, even slight problems that wouldn't show up at all on analog, can disrupt the hd signal.

on the other hand, i bet ip-over-coax adapters would have worked fine on that cable - i've used them on some pretty iffy wire with no problems.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:10 pm 
User avatar
Registered User

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1890
Location: SoCal

Offline
Mordavia wrote:
SDo all HD-SDI cameras disable their video outputs if the coax is not perfect?
The camera's output is not disabled, just the signal won't pass.

_________________
Be seeing you!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:25 am 
Registered User

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 9

Offline
The camera DID disable the video outputs.

The HD-SDI camera worked when the camera was connected directly to the DVR using our test cable.

The cameras test and HD-SDI outputs went black when connected to the previously installed wiring.

The camera never came back up when it was reconnected to the DVR using the test cable.

This was the biggest problem of the install, once the camera video output stopped, our troubleshooting was pointless.

And it was not fried, the power cabling was never to blame, just a small twist in the coax.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:47 am 
User avatar
Registered User

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1890
Location: SoCal

Offline
So a power recycle didn't bring the video back up? The camera is still unuseable?

_________________
Be seeing you!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

  
 Post subject: Re: HD-SDI Installation Nightmare
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:04 pm 
User avatar
Registered User

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 342
Location: the dog house

Offline
survtech wrote:
So a power recycle didn't bring the video back up? The camera is still unuseable?

read back a few posts:

Mordavia wrote:
So we ran new cabling. And it worked.

I pulled the old cabling out of the ceiling/walls and the only thing I could see was a twist in the coax. Although this wire worked for regular analog cameras it did not work with the digital watchdog camera.

Do all HD-SDI cameras disable their video outputs if the coax is not perfect?

If HD over coax installations require perfect coax cabling I think we will avoid using this technology in the future. Who know what condition previously ran wire might be in.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

It is currently Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:20 am

The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2003-2016 CCTVForum.com. All Rights Reserved.