Orange Security

I don't agree with this - RJ45 connectors are not simple or easy to make up (and test) for a first-timer. Yes there are plenty of guides and videos on the internet, however getting everyone right the first time is certainly not easy In a previous life, I used to look after a network for about 250 people on site and 750 off site in an industry that is very heavily regulated meaning absolutely everything had to be kept in-house. It's safe to say that I have made up a CAT5e cable or two! I still made the odd mistake when making up a cable (whatever you do, don't tell the wife I admitted to making a mistake!!!). I don't know anyone who makes a perfect RJ45 connection every single time. The alternative is to use pre-made patch leads of the right length, however, these are not easy to run (even 'snagless' clips still snag!) and require larger holes to be drilled. Video Baluns and DC Plugs/Sockets with either screw or push pin connectors are more simple and easier to fit (and require no special tools) than RJ45 connectors, especially for a newbie!

I can see if someone I know has one. My multimeter skills are limited. Do you think I should test the output of the power supply? EDIT: I ordered a new power supply on Amazon prime, this should rule out if the current power supply is faulty. I certainly would. You have no idea what the power supply is actually outputting - in the past, I have tested all sorts of cameras at different voltages (with a variable voltage power supply) and some of the results were a) really weird and b) unexpected!! It's a good idea to know what you know (if that makes sense!!).

Do you have access to (and know how to use) a multimeter?

Does it do that all the time or only at certain times of the day?

Just one thing to add to mattaggie's post: Don't make the mistake of thinking that doubling the number of megapixels allows you to identify at twice the distance. Because the pixels are increased in both the horizontal AND vertical directions, the approximate increased identification distance is the square root of 2 (or approx 1.4 times the distance). If you just want to see what is going on, a 2.8mm lens is great. Identification, not so much. For optimum results, use a wide angle camera such as that to see what's going on and a more telephoto camera to identify. In the example mattaggie used, have a telephoto view at the entrance of the drive (1st camera) and a general overview of what's going on on the drive (2nd camera). You'll be able to identify the person or vehicle from the 1st camera and see what happens on the 2nd camera. Think of the situation of parking your car on the drive. You come back and there's damage. With only the wide angle camera (2nd camera) you'll be able to see what happens but being very unlikely to identify the person or vehicle that did the damage. That's where the 1st camera comes into play in identifying the person. Unfortunately, most elements of security camera systems is a compromise so the belt and braces approach is to run 2 cameras. We have images on our website explaining this in more detail. Good luck!

You can't do both! As you increase the angle of view that your security camera gives, you decrease the distance you can see with it. Or more accurately, you decrease the identification distance of your camera. This is because you are spreading pixels so thinly across the area of view that you don't have enough definition to identify a person. You may recognize someone you know (from their build/clothes/gait etc) however if you produce an image and give it to the cops, you won't be able to identify them. If you just want an idea of what is going on in an area, wide angle lenses are fine (smaller number of mm). If you want to identify people then you're going to need a more telephoto lens.

I would recommend checking with an engineer that the size of hole in the location of the beam isn't going to compromise the structure.

Do you have the option of an HDMI input? There are various HD-TVI to HDMI converters available on the market. I haven't personally tested them but for $25 or so, it could be worth a shot. Are you actually recording the footage as well via a separate output or are you just displaying the footage on the TV? The reason I ask is that if the former, some cameras (such as the ones we sell) have 2 video outputs. One is for HD video and the other is CVBS/SD video: (Yellow: HD Video, White: CVBS SD Video, Red: 12V DC Power) You can use both the HD and the SD outputs at the same time - there'd be nothing wrong with having the HD feed going to the recorder and the SD going to the TV.

I know it's not in view. Great, isn't it!! I say that with my tongue in cheek of course - the reason I say that however is that the camera is doing exactly what the purpose of that camera is! You are absolutely correct - CCTV is not just for crime and is a conversation we have with people on a daily basis. In your suggestion of the guy coming to service the pool heater - again you are correct. If the owner of the property was concerned about ensuring the pool heater was serviced correctly then you wouldn't put the camera in that location to get a good view. Otherwise all you'd see is someone fiddling with the equipment but not have any real idea as to whether the service was done correctly.

The problem with security cameras is that there isn't a one-size-fits-all solution in terms of the best camera for any situation. The camera that you require to see long distances away, say 150 feet, is very different to that of a camera to look at a door way 20 feet away. I would recommend cameras with varifocal lenses as it allows you to adjust the angle of view to ensure you view exactly what you need and no more - not wasting pixels on unnecessary areas but instead concentrating the pixels on the key areas giving you the best chance of making an identification. That's not to say general overview cameras don't have a place in a security camera system, however you are unlikely to get identifying images. Any security camera you look at should have some guidance as to over what distance you'll be able to identify people over. Use that as a guideline, but don't make the mistake a lot of people do in assuming that the IR distance is the identification distance of a camera...I don't want you to be disappointed. Good luck! Tom - I apologize if I give the impression of trying to conduct business on a forum. That is not the case and is not my intention. I live and breathe CCTV - 7 days a week. It is something I am passionate about - I am sitting here writing this whilst eating my lunch! I have also spent (and continue to spend) an awful lot of time helping people who don't spend a bean with me. I also do not expect or push a single customer of mine to spend any money. I spent time helping out people in geographic markets that I don't even sell to - this forum was recently brought to my attention by a customer. These types of discussions don't benefit the community at all and in fact just end up putting people off the forum. If you have a personal problem with me, I am more than happy to receive your PM. Again, on the pricing topic that you raise again, I come back to the fact that the products I sell are better value than my direct competitors.

Rule number 1, never take advice from someone like orange security that spams a forum trying to promote their own site. Spamming a forum would be going back into the archives and posting on long dead threads where the OP is likely doesn't even remember the forum! Anything I am offering advice on is relatively recent. Either that or it would be going through and posting on every thread. You'll notice I've not commented on every thread either. I have come on here to offer helpful and constructive advice. In this particular post that is relatively recent, I have suggested a temporary solution to the OP that could well help given his current situation. It sounds like this is going to change soon (i.e. power being provided directly to the barn) and he doesn't want to be making up cable ends. Rather than making unhelpful comments at me, why not attempt to help the original poster? For the record, if it helps, I'm more than happy to remove the 2 links in this thread to products and find generic images on Google to show the chap what he needs to make my temporary suggestion work...that would mean you editing your post as well. Up to you?

Tom - you seem to have a bit of a problem with me. One may think you are following me around the forum! We have already covered this on the other thread - my products are not overpriced in comparison to my direct competitors. You may be able to buy some cheap stuff from Amazon/eBay/AliExpress or similar however we all know the issues that brings. As I said in my other post on this thread is that any advice offered is on a completely no obligation, no pressure basis. I am passionate about security cameras and try to help as many people as I can.

Tom: Despite your protestations, it's still not an a/c unit. As you keep focusing on it, I'll save you any further embarrassment - it's a pool heater! You continue to trot out the same old mildly offensive line that provides no useful information or help to anyone reading this thread, much less the original poster. I haven't been and am still not "full of crap". There is a significant difference between information and useful information and making that distinction is vital when it comes to planning any security camera system. It's not a matter of being pedantic on choice of words - it makes a real difference when installing a security camera system. This is nothing to do with being a "typical salesman" - it's about useful advice for people based not only on planning, specifying and installing many security camera systems. It's also based on supporting those customers after installation all the way through to actually getting convictions where the cops regularly comment along the lines of "this is the best security camera footage we've ever seen". Those are not one off comments! In the past, I have regularly achieved better results with standard definition D1 resolution equipment than these police officers have seen from 1080p cameras at the time. So, to continue to say that I am "full of crap" or such similar information whilst being insulting and rude is not helpful and completely untrue. As I said in my other post, the entire purpose of that particular camera is to identify people coming around the side of the property (to put your mind at ease, Tom, it's also not the only camera on that side of the property). The pool heating and pump system was specifically not of any concern at all to the customer. The windows are also non-opening and over 7 feet from the ground. They are also impact resistant and fully hurricane proof of over 150mph winds. From the camera mounting location, from memory, the gate is somewhere between 65 and 70 feet from the camera. I don't know exactly how wide the pool equipment is, but let's assume it's 10 feet wide or around 55 feet from the camera. The wide angle useless image is from a lens set at around 5 or 6mm. The useful image is of course much more zoomed in than that - I don't have the exact setting to hand but I imagine somewhere between 40 and 50mm. Had the lens been 2.8mm (which is what the subject of this thread originally was and seemingly is recommended by you) the image would be much wider, wasting even more pixels. At the 1080p resolution with a camera lens set at 2.8mm you'd expect to be able to identify a person at 12, maybe 15 feet at a push. Let's say we use the camera in the first post of this thread which are, I believe, 4MP resolution (let's also assume for a moment that the recorder is specified so that it can also record at 4MP too). The identification distance would be somewhere in the region of 20 feet. Maybe a couple of feet more - in fact, let's be generous and say 25 feet. You're not even half way to the pool equipment you are so concerned about. Let's now talk about 4K/8MP - that's getting better, but still not good enough - maybe 30 feet... if you're lucky you might get 35 feet. We're still no where near even the pool equipment. Sure, you could move a camera closer to the gate/pool equipment however you're then not viewing the whole side of the property as you seem to recommend. Not only that, but you are also removing the benefit of the great direction of view you have from the current location. The camera is currently positioned on part of the property that extends to the side slightly - this allows you to get as close to a head on view as is possible which as I'm sure you know gives you the best chance of identifying a person. You would also end up looking down at a much steeper angle on the person's head as opposed to a shallow angle as it is now. I have indeed tested cameras with multi mega pixel resolution (over 1080p or 2MP) and they simply don't increase the identification distance sufficiently to do the job. As a very rough guide, to double the identification distance (for a given angle of view) you need 4 times the number of pixels (as you have an increase the number of pixels in both the horizontal and vertical directions). Jerome: I have and continue to give helpful and constructive advice to the original poster of this thread. With the intention of helping him out. This tom guy has been nothing but insulting and derogatory not only about me personally but also about my business. I'm afraid I'm not prepared to sit by and not offer a rebuttal. My thoughts are to offer as much helpful and useful information to the customer as possible to allow them to make an informed decision. Of course, it's great if they want to buy from us, however the website is full of advice. That advice is all available on a no-obligation basis. I posted a couple of links to articles on my website to avoid making the post miles longer than it needs to be and with the intention of helping the original poster to work out what equipment is best for them.

What exactly is it that you want each of the cameras to do. You need a supplier to spend a bit of time with you and go through what you want each of your cameras to do. That is what we do - we spend time with our customers and offer no obligation advice to help people out with selecting their security cameras to give them the best system possible. If you'd like to book in a time to have a chat on the phone then don't hesitate to get in touch either through the PM system here or on the website - the address is my username (without the space) followed by .com. Look forward to hearing from you!

I'm afraid I really don't agree with you - my view is that CCTV is not collecting information but is in fact collecting useful information. That's not an a/c unit, and yes I am saying that image is less helpful than the zoomed in equivalent for the purposes of that camera. The whole point of that particular camera is to identify anyone who comes around the side of the property. There's absolutely no point in getting footage of a person stealing something or doing some damage if you're not able to identify that person. Use a camera with a varifocal lens and zoom it right in on your target subject so that if someone does come around the side of the property you massively increase your chances of identifying the person. My philosophy is very much that collecting useless information is, well, useless and people should concentrate on the useful information that is most likely going to help identify a perpetrator.

Rather than just trotting out "sales crap", perhaps you'd like to explain how what I'm saying is, in fact, "crap" as opposed to helpful information for anyone looking to purchase a security camera system? There are indeed such things as wasted pixels! Changing lenses (or in the case of a varifocal lens, zooming in) doesn't alter pixels - it alters what the pixels look at - it concentrates the pixels onto the important areas of an image. The aim is to hit your subject with as many pixels as possible. Our Golden Rule explains it, but I'll put the images here as a quick explanation (using thumbnails as I don't want to make the post too large): I've also got a handy overlay for that image: In this instance, everything other than the green pixels in the middle of the image are wasted (for the purposes of this particular camera). Each of the colored sections are explained in more detail on the Golden Rule page of our website if you are interested as to why only the green pixels are useful. By zooming the camera in, you get this: You are giving the camera a much greater chance of doing it's job and identifying a perpetrator on the second image than you do on the first. I'm afraid I am not aware of a new Hikvision (I presume that's what you mean by hik) 1080p HD-TVI camera with varifocal lens that retails for $80 from a reputable source.

I've not done it personally, but know people who have. I think the universal thing people have been doing is to swap the batteries out on a regular basis, not charging them at the same time as running the equipment. It should be fairly easy to calculate what size batteries are required. If everything is 12V, add up the Amps of everything, work out how many hours you want the system to last for solely on battery energy. Add a margin of error. Add another margin of error You can either use something such as this: https://www.orangesecurity.com/product/accessories/other-cables-connectors/dc-plug-pigtail/ or https://www.orangesecurity.com/product/accessories/cat5-video-baluns/dc-plug-screw-terminals/ to connect the power into your devices. The router may be the only thing these won't work with - often they have a different size connector. I'm sure you can find what you need for that...or just sacrifice a power supply.

As has already been said, without the model number of the recorder it's very difficult to advise. If you don't have the model number, a link to the web page you bought it from may help?

I'm sorry - but how is what I wrote "sales crap"? Everything I've said is not only completely true, but is also good advice that should be followed by the original poster (and anyone who is planning a security camera system). Breaking it down: Anyone who solely recommends wide angle cameras (e.g. 2.8mm, 3.6mm etc) for every location is very unlikely to either have the knowledge or have the best interests of their customer at heart. You waste so many pixels. People who do this, then try to upsell resolution - it used to be upselling to 1080p now it's to multi-megapixel IP/4k (analogue or IP) and beyond. Ironically, it's often these same people who then go on to recommend a recorder/HDD combination that is wholly unsuitable to the additional resolution...solely so they don't look expensive. The recommendation is then to reduce the recorded resolution - negating the point of having a higher resolution camera. We are more than happy to help customers on a no-obligation basis who aren't sure about quotes they have received from other companies. It is amazing the number of times that I see high resolution cameras specified followed by a recorder with a tiny hard drive saying 30 days of recorded footage and a small-print note saying (when recording at lower resolution) or similar. You're much more likely to get a better result (i.e. identifying the perpetrator in a crime) if you have narrow angles of view concentrated in and are not wasting pixels as explained in Our Golden Rule. Next I go on to comment on the camera body style that has been recommended to the person. The advice here is totally sound also. The camera body style is likely not the best one to use. Unless the absolute vandal resistance is key, the open dome style camera is by far and away the better option. Possibly a bullet camera also depending on the installation location. I would say that everything I have said is most definitely not "sales crap" but in fact the polar opposite - good, useful advice openly offered to the original poster of this thread. On another note, I also find it interesting that you consider my products to be "way over priced" - the products I sell are better value than my direct competitors (both IP or TVI). Of course you can by security cameras for far less money, but you have no idea what you're buying (especially when you buy from Amazon/eBay or similar). Not only that, but good luck getting any support if there are issues either with the initial set up or warranty claims further down the line. It's not only about the purchase price.

If you're planning on upgrading the system in the future to include further cameras and a DVR then why not purchase the DVR and a single camera at this stage and then just add the additional cameras later on down the line. I know many people are great advocates of IP cameras and will say they are "plug and play". There are many more issues than that - I speak to people on an almost daily basis who are fed up with their IP equipment and just want the connection between the Camera and the DVR. I won't derail the thread any further however.

I would suggest those aren't the best cameras for your installation. I also wouldn't trust someone who just recommends 4 of those cameras for an installation. It's likely they won't be the optimal cameras for your situation, but are an easy way to 'tick the boxes' that you ask for. Those cameras have a 2.8mm lens - this is a very wide angle lens. You're spreading your pixels far too thinly over the area you're looking to cover. On our website we have our 'Golden Rule' (https://www.orangesecurity.com/orange-security-golden-rule/). Take a read of this and you'll get a better understanding as to why such a wide angle lens isn't a good idea! In short, however by spreading your pixels thinly you may see a large area but you are limiting your chances of identifying a person. The cameras recommended are also the traditional dome style - these aren't a great idea as unless the camera is set up 100% perfect (and even then there's still a risk) you will get the IR illumination reflecting off the dome and back into the camera lens. At best this will make your night time images look pretty nasty. At worst, you won't see anything. If you check out our website you will see that we also stock a traditional vandal dome style camera however this is for our customers who have no choice but to have these cameras - you'd be much better off with an open dome style camera. IP is likely not the best technology to you could use for your security cameras - we have a great article that explains some of the basic differences here : https://www.orangesecurity.com/advice/full-hd-1080p-resolution/tvi-cvi-sdi-ahd-ip-whats/. It's hard to give a full analysis of the system proposed with only the information given in your opening post, however if you'd like me to take a look at the quote and provide some more detailed feedback, please don't hesitate to send an e-mail to help@orangesecurity.com and mark it for the attention of Matt.

A lot of the Chinese manufacturers use either the same bodies or copy each other's anyway so I wouldn't be comfortable guessing who the original manufacturer of the camera is. It sounds unlikely to be a power supply issue, however for the sake of ruling it out, it's worth disconnecting all the other cameras and just having the one camera on there. Out of interest, are you only having this issue at night, or is it all the time? As you continue to click the up button, the DVR should be sending a 'move up' signal to the camera. If the camera then tilts down, pans/zooms correctly I would hazard a guess that it's working correctly...however again you know what they say about assumptions!!! It could be that when pointing up, something has fallen on it and made it point down. The motor still thinks it's pointing up so when you tilt it down it can go to it's stop but when you go to tilt it back up, it can only go to what it thinks is the limit? I am afraid to say, however, that it sounds most likely that something inside the camera is not working as it should. Either something is broken or the calibration is out. You can try the customer help (Contact Now button on the product listing), however I wouldn't hold your breath for a useful response - I'm afraid that is the problem with buying from Aliexpress/eBay (where most comes direct from China anyway) or many similar other stores. Buying from reputable sellers who will be there to help in the event of something going wrong - where they have extensive experience with the product is your best bet. Good luck!