Client robbed night after install, police unable to use...

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

...recorded video as evidence for arrest.

 

I just installed a PC based dvr system including 8 330tvl IR (13' night range) and two QLR0440 video capture cards from lorex cctv

 

system specifications

 

(refurbished exec PC)

Compaq evo

Win XP service pack 2

40GB IDE HDD

128mb GPU (onboard)

512mb RAM

(2) QLR0440 capture cards

 

**system specifically dedicated to cctv, no other apps running**

 

The night after i finished installation the guy gets robbed. Something like 4 cases of high dollar liquer.

 

cameras capture the video feed, and an e-mail alert is sent to client cell via motion detect.

 

everything worked perfectly, just as advertised...EXCEPT for the most important thing, video playback quality.

 

It looked like complete crap, you couldn't make out faces at all, and the perps didn't even notice the cameras on break-in.

 

so i decide, "well maybe it's just the camera res" so i bring with me a 420TVL sony IR camera with 150' IR range. Plug it in and it looks great, until i get to recording to re-test the playback, at that point i realise it still looks like crap, just not as much.

 

I've been installing these things for a year or so now and i've been afraid this might happen, but my owner is not willing to adjust price to buy better equipment so he sells em "good enough but not great"

 

this is not only annoying, but is also detrimental to the reputation of our company and to me as an individual installer.

 

 

i mean we are using unshielded 22ga telephone wire for cable runs and splicing with wire twisting and electrical tape.

 

so yeah, signal loss is a definate consideration with this situation i'm thinking.

 

 

any advice?

[VST_Man 1]

if your live view is clean and the playback is not, the playback is the issue. you can't fix that but you maybe able to adjust the recording settings "up" to improve the quality of playback.

 

the cabling methods you explained kinda made me think...........if you know it's crap, why keep twisting and taping? do you really need us to say that?

[griffonsystems 0]

start looking for a new company to work for, this business is based on referrals and if your current clients arent happy with their systems the word will get out and the business will dry up

[Ronald 0]

Hi,

 

I see that type of wiring hookup all the time in existing installations. Unfortunately, it appears to be the norm around here. But personally, I would never do such a thing for neatness and safety reason. Here, we use those quick disconnect plugs. You know those you have to squeeze to hold on to the wires.

 

Regards,

 

Ron

[Guest]

No comments, just shaking my head!

 

JD

 

 

 

...recorded video as evidence for arrest.

 

I just installed a PC based dvr system including 8 330tvl IR (13' night range) and two QLR0440 video capture cards from lorex cctv

 

system specifications

 

(refurbished exec PC)

Compaq evo

Win XP service pack 2

40GB IDE HDD

128mb GPU (onboard)

512mb RAM

(2) QLR0440 capture cards

 

**system specifically dedicated to cctv, no other apps running**

 

The night after i finished installation the guy gets robbed. Something like 4 cases of high dollar liquer.

 

cameras capture the video feed, and an e-mail alert is sent to client cell via motion detect.

 

everything worked perfectly, just as advertised...EXCEPT for the most important thing, video playback quality.

 

It looked like complete crap, you couldn't make out faces at all, and the perps didn't even notice the cameras on break-in.

 

so i decide, "well maybe it's just the camera res" so i bring with me a 420TVL sony IR camera with 150' IR range. Plug it in and it looks great, until i get to recording to re-test the playback, at that point i realise it still looks like crap, just not as much.

 

I've been installing these things for a year or so now and i've been afraid this might happen, but my owner is not willing to adjust price to buy better equipment so he sells em "good enough but not great"

 

this is not only annoying, but is also detrimental to the reputation of our company and to me as an individual installer.

 

 

i mean we are using unshielded 22ga telephone wire for cable runs and splicing with wire twisting and electrical tape.

 

so yeah, signal loss is a definate consideration with this situation i'm thinking.

 

 

any advice?

[rory 0]

No comments, just shaking my head!

 

JD

 

Im banging mine on the wall here!!!

[rory 0]

...recorded video as evidence for arrest.

 

I just installed a PC based dvr system including 8 330tvl IR (13' night range) and two QLR0440 video capture cards from lorex cctv

 

system specifications

 

(refurbished exec PC)

Compaq evo

Win XP service pack 2

40GB IDE HDD

128mb GPU (onboard)

512mb RAM

(2) QLR0440 capture cards

 

**system specifically dedicated to cctv, no other apps running**

 

The night after i finished installation the guy gets robbed. Something like 4 cases of high dollar liquer.

 

cameras capture the video feed, and an e-mail alert is sent to client cell via motion detect.

 

everything worked perfectly, just as advertised...EXCEPT for the most important thing, video playback quality.

 

It looked like complete crap, you couldn't make out faces at all, and the perps didn't even notice the cameras on break-in.

 

so i decide, "well maybe it's just the camera res" so i bring with me a 420TVL sony IR camera with 150' IR range. Plug it in and it looks great, until i get to recording to re-test the playback, at that point i realise it still looks like crap, just not as much.

 

I've been installing these things for a year or so now and i've been afraid this might happen, but my owner is not willing to adjust price to buy better equipment so he sells em "good enough but not great"

 

this is not only annoying, but is also detrimental to the reputation of our company and to me as an individual installer.

 

 

i mean we are using unshielded 22ga telephone wire for cable runs and splicing with wire twisting and electrical tape.

 

so yeah, signal loss is a definate consideration with this situation i'm thinking.

 

 

any advice?

 

Better DVR, Better Cameras, Better Cable.

[jisaac 0]

I will be the one to say it.

Have you ever heard the phrase "junk in junk out"???

Here is the key. Dont install junk and you wont receive junk.

Simple.

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

But you must understand that i have nothing to do with the quality of the product beyond my own installation and advice (although being the head installer i should have full fiscal control over what a client asks for in relation to what they get)

 

and "ronald", what type of wiring hookups do you reccomend? link?

 

and rory, i completely agree, i spend enough time installing the networking on these things, replacing the cameras for better ones and then realizing it's the card makes for a very frustrating install (ie: we are talking i get 100 dollars an install for 4 cameras plus dvr card, no hourly, and that includes my tech support anytime they unplug and scramble the damn things)

 

if it were up to me i would use conduit where conduit was needed, buy only industry standard cable and never use cmos cameras or dvr cards with low res for recording.

 

side note***

 

i just installed another one of these systems today on a brand new e-machines computer. the frame rate is awful as is the quality of recording.

 

whenever i try remote login the server computer crashes and has to be re-booted.

 

talk about troubleshooting

 

i'm clueless on this one as it's never happened to me before

 

instead of 30fps (per camera) i'm getting like 10 to 15 at max

 

 

i'm about at my wits end here, i'm telling my boss tomorrow no more cmos cameras, no more of the same dvr card and no more crap cable or i quit.

 

and that would surly be the end of the business as not as single other employee knows how to set up the systems he sells efficiently

[Ronald 0]

"ronald", what type of wiring hookups do you reccomend?

 

Blue plastic connector pairs (a female and a male). The same type of connectors utilized in cars in which you squeeze in with a tool to secure the wire. You MIGHT find those in auto parts stores or better yet in large electronics stores. I don't have a link.

 

Regards,

 

Ronald

[rory 0]

(ie: we are talking i get 100 dollars an install for 4 cameras plus dvr card, no hourly, and that includes my tech support anytime they unplug and scramble the damn things)

 

If that includes running the wire, personally I would never take the job.

Actually if I didnt have to run the wire, I still wouldnt do it for $100.

[Guest]

My dealers charge about 130,- USD per camera + the wiring for about 6,- USD pr meter included the cable (RG59+2).

 

JD

 

 

(ie: we are talking i get 100 dollars an install for 4 cameras plus dvr card, no hourly, and that includes my tech support anytime they unplug and scramble the damn things)

 

If that includes running the wire, personally I would never take the job.

Actually if I didnt have to run the wire, I still wouldnt do it for $100.

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

yeah, that does include the wiring, and is supposed to include full tech support (including camera moves) for one year.

 

i'm a chemical, biological, radiological, and nuclear specialist for the US army with an associates degree in science.

 

i think i might just quit.

 

the company also pays employees only when they recieve payment (ie: they owe me 600 dollars at the moment) that means if something goes awry; doesn't matter if i did my job right or not, i don't get paid until they do...

 

any legal advice?

[jisaac 0]

one way you have to look at is this.

If the person who is selling this system also includes at the time of sale a more expensive option, and the end user opts for the cheapy.

Well then it's the customers fault. He chose to save money over ensuring a quality product.

Most everyone knows on here that I am not one to advocate the installation of cheap systems.

However at some point you have to realize that no matter what. It will never be the quality that they see on "CSI". And so no matter they wont be as pleased as they think they will be when buying the system. So if they are offered a recommendation of a premium system and opt for the cheap system. Well then its there own damn fault.

Its a great time to slip in the suddle "I TOLD YOU SO"

 

(JUST KIDDING. THAT NEVER GOES WELL)

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

is 1400USD for 4 cmos 330tvl cameras, caption card, install, and 60ft cable per camera cheap by industry standards?

 

including netword and tech support?

[rory 0]

Maybe goto the owner with a better idea .. as mentioned by jisaac .. tell him you would also like the option to quote them better systems .. if they decide on the cheap ones and you are happy just slapping those in for $100 .. so be it .. they got the product they paid for .. though I still think $100 labour is way too low.

[rory 0]

is 1400USD for 4 cmos 330tvl cameras, caption card, install, and 60ft cable per camera cheap by industry standards?

 

including netword and tech support?

 

No, that is expensive for that .. even would be cheaper in the bahamas where we pay 42% Customs tax plus about $150 average shipping!

 

although .. what type of capture card again?

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

lorex QLR0440

 

oh ****, i forgot, this includes a dedicated refurbished computer with 40gb HDD 512mb RAM and 128mb GPU

 

but yeah, i think for what they charge they could pay me better, especially since not a single person in the company knows how to do wat i do (even though i have attempted training them on several occasions)

 

they just don't get it for some reason

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

what if those cameras were sony CCD 420TVL?

 

and if we used good cable and a dedicated 4ch DVR?

 

the company would still make over 250% profit and i wouldn't have to feel bad about installing crap

[rory 0]

Sony CCDs come in all kinds of cameras, prices, and quality ..

typically that would still be budget cameras.

But yeah you could still sell them a better system than that .. even if using budget CCDs.

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

he won't listen to me, and our account manager is even worse with price cuts...i mean i don't even have wire strippers.

 

what system would you reccomend?

[TMJALARMSNATE 0]

oh and we are a budget camera company

 

we lack the manpower or the presige to become bigger at this time

[griffonsystems 0]

whats stopping you from going out on your own and selling and installing product that you and the client are happy with...the 100buck an install is ridiculous and not knowing when you will get paid is even worse, they should be getting 50% on sign and 50% after install/training so that they are covered for hardware costs prior to even starting the job...where are you located?

[501 0]

QUIT! Come work for me. $100 is a complete and total joke. Find a better job for sure.

[RickA 0]

http://www.dolphincomponents.com/catalog-1.asp Try this for wire connectors, have used these for years. As far as doing a job for 100.00$ and then having to wait till they get paid.... for that money it would be nothing to do with work, just telling the rest what to do, and not being responsible for the job.