1200 feet CAT5 and PVC underground Project

[andresdamas 0]

I am planing to run 14 CAT5 cable underground using PVC the length will be around 1300 feet, all cameras are 2MP 12 volt Ip cameras

 

my question is:

 

1.- How much and where can I find a cable roll bigger than 1000feet CAT5, most my vendor only sell 500 and 1000 feet

 

2.- What POE switch will be perfect for this installation, there is any drop in Volt due to distance?

 

About router. has to be some specific router or can be any decent profesional route?

[Kawboy12R 0]

How do you plan to get an IP camera to work for longer than 328 feet per run? With an active repeater of some kind every 100m you don't need 1300 unbroken feet at a time.

[andresdamas 0]

How do you plan to get an IP camera to work for longer than 328 feet per run? With an active repeater of some kind every 100m you don't need 1300 unbroken feet at a time.

 

Well I thought you can run CAT5 Without repeater for longer than 1000 feet., I am confused, any link where i can look for info, I know CAT5 will transmit the video but i am concern with POE, or should I run a different power line?

[Kawboy12R 0]

You can transmit analog video over cat 5, 5e, and 6 for more than a 1000' using baluns. I've read some crazy distance numbers using active baluns. The 328' limit for IP isn't a camera limit it's a network design limit. Seems strange that internet covers the planet but once you start running it yourself you seem to be limited to 328'. You'll have to convert to something like optical fibre for longer IP runs. Sit down before you get a price quote though. Wikipedia isn't a bad place to start to learn about the specs and limits of cat 5e and cat 6 cables. You can run more power and more data over cat 6 but you're still stuck with 328' max for IP networking. If you can place a network switch every 300' or so then you can do 1300' in chunks. Burial grade switches are hard to come by though.

[andresdamas 0]

You can transmit analog video over cat 5, 5e, and 6 for more than a 1000' using baluns. I've read some crazy distance numbers using active baluns. The 328' limit for IP isn't a camera limit it's a network design limit. Seems strange that internet covers the planet but once you start running it yourself you seem to be limited to 328'. You'll have to convert to something like optical fibre for longer IP runs. Sit down before you get a price quote though. Wikipedia isn't a bad place to start to learn about the specs and limits of cat 5e and cat 6 cables. You can run more power and more data over cat 6 but you're still stuck with 328' max for IP networking. If you can place a network switch every 300' or so then you can do 1300' in chunks. Burial grade switches are hard to come by though.

 

 

So you are saying that for IP 2Megapixel Cameras it can not transmit video in a distance further than 400 feet? that is so bad!!! and also I will have to buy everywhere and run extra line for power the switches.....

[Kawboy12R 0]

I'm saying that networking gear using UTP (unshielded twisted pair) cable (cat 5, 5e, and 6) won't transmit data farther than 328'. IP network cameras transmit video as network data and have the same limits as everything else. Optical fibre equipment is commonly used for longer runs. You could use wireless technology of some form as well. Depending on neighbouring 2.4ghz pollution, a wifi bridge and some fancy antennae (preferably mounted up high, possibly up a simple tower or on the roof) might work. Maybe. If I read your post right, you want to run 14 2mp cameras?? All from separate locations 1300' away or are they being run wired under 328' to an NVR (or switch) and the NVR's (or switch's) connection to the rest of the network is 1300'? Either way though, that's a LOT of data to run over wireless. Not sure what you're watching, the importance of 100% uptime, or the exact placements of cams, but life would be simpler and the network a lot more reliable if you could run 110v power plus fibre optics out to a sheltered location (weather-proof box of some kind, small outbuilding, or whatever) and run the cameras into a switch out near the end of the run.

[GrouchoBoucho 0]

your poe switch goes at one end of the 1300' pipe, your nvr at the other end... connect the two ends via fiber.

 

So you are saying that for IP 2Megapixel Cameras it can not transmit video in a distance further than 400 feet?

no. ip cameras can send video anywhere in the world... but you need to build the network properly. *ethernet* is limited to 100m (approx 328') per segment. fiber is probably your best bet in this case; wireless won't give nearly enough bandwidth and will be highly unreliable unless you have unobstructed line-of-sight.

 

remember that the camera isn't "sending video" as such; it's encoding the video into network data. anywhere you can send the data, you can send the video. it can go over 3g (cellular), over the internet, over fiber, using dsl, etc. but fourteen 2mp cameras will potentially generate a *lot* of data, so the network connecting them to the dvr has to be able to handle that traffic.

[andresdamas 0]

your poe switch goes at one end of the 1300' pipe, your nvr at the other end... connect the two ends via fiber.

 

So you are saying that for IP 2Megapixel Cameras it can not transmit video in a distance further than 400 feet?

no. ip cameras can send video anywhere in the world... but you need to build the network properly. *ethernet* is limited to 100m (approx 328') per segment. fiber is probably your best bet in this case; wireless won't give nearly enough bandwidth and will be highly unreliable unless you have unobstructed line-of-sight.

 

remember that the camera isn't "sending video" as such; it's encoding the video into network data. anywhere you can send the data, you can send the video. it can go over 3g (cellular), over the internet, over fiber, using dsl, etc. but fourteen 2mp cameras will potentially generate a *lot* of data, so the network connecting them to the dvr has to be able to handle that traffic.

 

Only 7 cameras out 14 will be ran over 500 feet and only 3 cameras out these 7 will be ran over 1000 feet , I know fiber can be an option, but still have to run conduit and trench 1500 feet, so now i am thinking to use Antennas, like access point, cameras will mounted in a big poles, so just 7 cameras will be using access point antennas and the other 7 just a regular Ethernet cat5 cable.....

 

so am I in a right direction? 7 antennas is too much date to handle it wireless? antenas transmit in a low speed? Antennas handling IP are plug and play?

 

Thank you for all you help!!!

[andresdamas 0]

your poe switch goes at one end of the 1300' pipe, your nvr at the other end... connect the two ends via fiber.

 

So you are saying that for IP 2Megapixel Cameras it can not transmit video in a distance further than 400 feet?

no. ip cameras can send video anywhere in the world... but you need to build the network properly. *ethernet* is limited to 100m (approx 328') per segment. fiber is probably your best bet in this case; wireless won't give nearly enough bandwidth and will be highly unreliable unless you have unobstructed line-of-sight.

 

remember that the camera isn't "sending video" as such; it's encoding the video into network data. anywhere you can send the data, you can send the video. it can go over 3g (cellular), over the internet, over fiber, using dsl, etc. but fourteen 2mp cameras will potentially generate a *lot* of data, so the network connecting them to the dvr has to be able to handle that traffic.

 

what about if I am planing to install 7 2MP ip cameras using ENH200 bridge access point?, the area is a parking lot so no trees, no building in the middle, the longest run is 900 feet away from router, so planing to have 2 ENH200 per camera so one for receiver and one for transmitter.

 

Have you guys done something like that before?

 

Do you think cameras wont have any delay in speed and resolution?

 

Do i have to use any specific router for this?

 

how stable is this solution?

 

Thank you

[EarlT 0]

Look up Ethernet extenders.

[jeromephone 6]

if you run fiber you can get underground rated 6 strand for a reasonable price check the major supply houses. also you can get switches with built in fiber adaptors for less than standard media convertors. look up allied telesys. I am assuming you have power at the both ends. The nice thing about fiber is with the 3 spare pairs you can run seperate out your camera data from you other network traffice if you want to.

[andresdamas 0]

I appreciate u feedback, but I am avoid fiber because:

1,- no idea about fiber and I can't learn with this customer

2,,- no BUDGET,

3.- just open the trench over asphalt, company is charging me 4 dollar per feet and there are 1500 feet

 

Thank u for u help... but I am asking about whireless ENH500 antenna and evaluate that solution even if it isn't the perfect one

[Kawboy12R 0]

No way to get power to the cams except via that trench? If you were going to go wireless, eliminating the $6000 trench would go nicely towards wireless equipment. If this is for a client then learning about fibre is cheap compared to screwing up the job and having him reject a whole pile of wireless equipment if it doesn't work either. I'm guessing that a $150 consumer grade wireless network extender isn't going to work for that many cameras. That's a whole different kettle of fish compared to playing with it for yourself.

[andresdamas 0]

There is powerWhere cameras r going to be located, so no need trench for power sofar, I will try first and test and I will let u know, I know fiber is the good option, but bidget is limitated.....

 

Thank u for advise, I will test the wirless and see whathappen before installation

[bigglebowski 0]

Look into a company called Ubiquiti, they have some well performing low priced gear that should be able to do this project assuming you have the line of sight. They also have a forum that you should be able to find similar projects to yours, or you can post a layout for them for help.

 

Depending on the layout you should be able to go with a point to multi point configuration. You may find a mix of PTP and PTMP combinations to do the job.

 

I am talking about the wireless networking gear and not their IP camera stuff which seems like it may be more residential grade at this time.

[andresdamas 0]

I didn't understand u reply, I am trying to do it wireless with anntennas

[bigglebowski 0]

I didn't understand u reply, I am trying to do it wireless with anntennas

 

Thats what they do wireless networking, look at the airmax products tab on their site. I meant as an alternate suggestion for the bridge you posted.

 

http://www.ubnt.com/

[thewireguys 3]

Going by what you have posted already. Is this your first time installing IP cameras and wireless?

 

If I where you I would run fiber over wireless since you don't have experience with wireless. PTP links are easy but PTMP with 7+ 2MP cameras can get very tricky if you don't know what your doing. Before you even think about designing a wireless network like this you MUST do a site survey to see what available frequency are available for you to use.

 

What manufactures cameras do you plan on using?

How much bandwidth do you see each camera producing?

What VMS/NVR?

[andresdamas 0]

I am trying to save around 8 thousand in trench, cable and confuit to the customer using wirless technology, I think based in the amount it isn't bad just to try, I spoke with the engineer at engenous and they told me that the ENH500 is design for what I am trying to do, also I know about ip address and network and techsupport told me that it is very straig forward....

 

Sound like everybody has done this job with fiber and no body has done it wireless..... r people afraid to try wireless technology?

Tech support told me, we won't sale a product who isn't working with u product..

 

Here is the link

 

http://www.engeniustech.com/business-networking/outdoor-access-points-client-bridges/9340-enh500-

[thewireguys 3]

I have done many wireless projects with the longest PTP wireless link we helped install was 37 miles. I have also done many PTMP setups for cameras and enterprise WIFI networks. So no I am not a afraid of wireless.

 

Getting wireless to work is easy making it reliable is the hard part

 

Oh and the only wireless gear we had issues with was Engenous but that gear we installed about 6 years ago so they could have changed a lot since then.

 

Also I recommend you use a solution where you can manage and monitor all APs from one interface. Good luck!

[andresdamas 0]

Good to heard tnat, so u r a pro in this wireless, thx for u feedback, what brand do u recomend for this type of project?

 

I really appreciate u feedback

[thewireguys 3]

You need to answer the questions I asked before I can point you in the right direction.

[andresdamas 0]

You need to answer the questions I asked before I can point you in the right direction.

Answewring u question:

 

Camera manufacturing vivotek

Nvr might be vivotek software or milestone or standalone nvr that I already installed with this cameras and work fine......

 

What I am thinking to do I to buy 4 cameras and installed at the pole with anntenas and see how they work , I will test them out for couple days, if I have problem with video or loww resolution or cameras loosing conection ,I will infor the customer and I will send another proposal inncluding. Fiber and trench....

I hope this wireless u r talking about work fine....

 

Btw thank u very very very much for u time

 

 

I hope this

[yeero 0]

You can try HD SDI cameras and high quality satelite coax cables.The distance you can reach might be even 350meters using high quality cables 250m should be standard on average cables. Solution might be cheaper than wifi...