Timestamp on security displays

[janiegh 0]

I’ve been looking for a place where I could find an answer to this question. Perhaps you can help me with this, as several of you seem to have experience with hotel security systems.

 

In a book I’ve been reading, there is a small hotel that has a 16 camera CCTV security system. In the front lobby of the hotel there is a monitor that shows all 16 screens.

 

Would the time stamp on all of the screens show the same exact time?

 

In other words, would all of the cameras connected with the system be programmed to show the same time?

[Soundy 1]

With analog systems, the cameras themselves don't display the time, nor can you set the time on them. The time display you see is being generated by the DVR itself. IP cameras typically have their own clocks and can display their own time, but we usually disable that display and just go with the recorder's time.

 

How accurate that is depends on the DVR. I've seen some that were years out of date because someone forgot to set the date and time when it was installed. I've seen instances where the date and time settings were tampered with. I regularly see systems that are out by a few minutes because the realtime clocks simply drift over time, and some that are out by an hour because the system isn't configured to switch with Daylight Savings Time, and some that are out by a few hours because the time zone wasn't set properly.

 

Ideally, your DVR should have an internet connection if for no other purpose than to allow it to sync with an internet time server.

[janiegh 0]

With analog systems, the cameras themselves don't display the time, nor can you set the time on them. The time display you see is being generated by the DVR itself. IP cameras typically have their own clocks and can display their own time, but we usually disable that display and just go with the recorder's time.

 

How accurate that is depends on the DVR. I've seen some that were years out of date because someone forgot to set the date and time when it was installed. I've seen instances where the date and time settings were tampered with. I regularly see systems that are out by a few minutes because the realtime clocks simply drift over time, and some that are out by an hour because the system isn't configured to switch with Daylight Savings Time, and some that are out by a few hours because the time zone wasn't set properly.

 

Ideally, your DVR should have an internet connection if for no other purpose than to allow it to sync with an internet time server.

 

Thank you for the reply. With a 16 camera surveillance system, would all of the cameras be recording to the same DVR? Would all of the recordings show the same time (whether it's accurate or not)?

[Soundy 1]

With analog systems, the cameras themselves don't display the time, nor can you set the time on them. The time display you see is being generated by the DVR itself. IP cameras typically have their own clocks and can display their own time, but we usually disable that display and just go with the recorder's time.

 

How accurate that is depends on the DVR. I've seen some that were years out of date because someone forgot to set the date and time when it was installed. I've seen instances where the date and time settings were tampered with. I regularly see systems that are out by a few minutes because the realtime clocks simply drift over time, and some that are out by an hour because the system isn't configured to switch with Daylight Savings Time, and some that are out by a few hours because the time zone wasn't set properly.

 

Ideally, your DVR should have an internet connection if for no other purpose than to allow it to sync with an internet time server.

 

Thank you for the reply. With a 16 camera surveillance system, would all of the cameras be recording to the same DVR?

In general, yes. DVRs typically come in four, eight, 16 and 32-channel designs. It's possible a 16-channel system could use two eight-channel machines, or four four-channel machines, but they probably wouldn't all be displaying on the same monitor that way (there ARE ways to do that, but it just gets more complicated as you go - safest assumption is simply that there's a single 16-channel recorder).

 

Would all of the recordings show the same time (whether it's accurate or not)?

Yes.

[janiegh 0]

With analog systems, the cameras themselves don't display the time, nor can you set the time on them. The time display you see is being generated by the DVR itself. IP cameras typically have their own clocks and can display their own time, but we usually disable that display and just go with the recorder's time.

 

How accurate that is depends on the DVR. I've seen some that were years out of date because someone forgot to set the date and time when it was installed. I've seen instances where the date and time settings were tampered with. I regularly see systems that are out by a few minutes because the realtime clocks simply drift over time, and some that are out by an hour because the system isn't configured to switch with Daylight Savings Time, and some that are out by a few hours because the time zone wasn't set properly.

 

Ideally, your DVR should have an internet connection if for no other purpose than to allow it to sync with an internet time server.

 

Thank you for the reply. With a 16 camera surveillance system, would all of the cameras be recording to the same DVR?

In general, yes. DVRs typically come in four, eight, 16 and 32-channel designs. It's possible a 16-channel system could use two eight-channel machines, or four four-channel machines, but they probably wouldn't all be displaying on the same monitor that way (there ARE ways to do that, but it just gets more complicated as you go - safest assumption is simply that there's a single 16-channel recorder).

 

Would all of the recordings show the same time (whether it's accurate or not)?

Yes.

 

Interesting. Is there a way to post a picture on this forum? I'd like to know if the camera in this photo is a part of the CCTV system, or if it's an independent wireless camera?

 

Probably won't post again until tomorrow.

 

Thanks!

[janiegh 0]

This is a picture of a camera that was placed on a wall overhang right outside one of the hotel room doors.

 

Can you identify what type of surveillance camera it is? Could it be part of the hotel CCTV system? Or is it a wireless surveillance camera? If so, how would it be monitored?

[tomcctv 187]

hi. what makes you think its a camera ..... it could just be a maintenace point for there network.

[janiegh 0]

hi. what makes you think its a camera ..... it could just be a maintenace point for there network.

 

I know it's a camera. Video taken from this camera was shown on network news shows. The camera itself was identified in one of the video clips from a news show.

[tomcctv 187]

which show was it on. do you have a link.

[janiegh 0]

which show was it on. do you have a link.

 

I can look for it later. Not sure if I still have the link or if it still works.

 

But that really is not relevant at this point.

 

I'd just like to know what kind of surveillance camera this is. CCTV or Wireless?

[tomcctv 187]

I'd just like to know what kind of surveillance camera this is. CCTV or Wireless?

 

 

 

from a box on the wall. the only people that could tell you is the hotel managment .. other than that there is not much else you can do.

 

 

why is it of interest ??

[janiegh 0]

I'd just like to know what kind of surveillance camera this is. CCTV or Wireless?

 

 

 

from a box on the wall. the only people that could tell you is the hotel managment .. other than that there is not much else you can do.

 

 

why is it of interest ??

 

There are several people on this board who are familiar with the installation of security systems in small hotels. Perhaps one of them can identify the type of surveillance camera it is by looking at the picture I posted.

[tomcctv 187]

There are several people on this board who are familiar with the installation of security systems in small hotels. Perhaps one of them can identify the type of surveillance camera it is by looking at the picture I posted.

 

 

 

yes i think most of us have done hotels for 8 to 500 cam installs .

 

 

but you would have to be psychic to guess what is in a 4inch x 4inch JB box

 

 

its like me asking you what is in here .

 

 

[janiegh 0]

Here's the picture again. It's more like 12" x 12." The 2 circular areas on the bottom must be the lenses.

 

Any other opinions about what type of surveillance camera this is? Have you ever seen anything like this?

[ak357 0]

 

why is it of interest ??

 

I agree with you Tom

Why this type of ?

Are we trying to help "good" or "bad" guy here

something I do not like

Edited February 16, 2012 by Guest

[Soundy 1]

Well as the others have said, we're not psychic, so the best anyone can give is an educated guess... and mine would be that this is a custom-built covert camera. The two circular areas on the bottom would be the standard conduit knockouts, and they appear to be intact - I would expect the lens to be behind that sloppily-cut pentagonal hole in the front. Someone probably just put the box there, mounted a small (probably board-type) camera inside of it, and cut a hole for the lens in the cover plate.

 

If that's a 12x12 box, it's possible there's an internal recorder, although I suspect it's more likely simply wired into the existing system. If you can see the screen, it should be easy to tell if this camera is displayed there. I wouldn't expect it to be wireless, as there still needs to be power run to the thing anyway.

 

Since this all started with the timestamp question and then wanting to know if this camera would have the same time as the rest of them, I have to wonder if it's caught YOU doing something and you're looking for some way to discredit the video evidence... looks like I'm not alone in my "curiosity"...

[janiegh 0]

Well as the others have said, we're not psychic, so the best anyone can give is an educated guess... and mine would be that this is a custom-built covert camera. The two circular areas on the bottom would be the standard conduit knockouts, and they appear to be intact - I would expect the lens to be behind that sloppily-cut pentagonal hole in the front. Someone probably just put the box there, mounted a small (probably board-type) camera inside of it, and cut a hole for the lens in the cover plate.

 

If that's a 12x12 box, it's possible there's an internal recorder, although I suspect it's more likely simply wired into the existing system. If you can see the screen, it should be easy to tell if this camera is displayed there. I wouldn't expect it to be wireless, as there still needs to be power run to the thing anyway.

 

Since this all started with the timestamp question and then wanting to know if this camera would have the same time as the rest of them, I have to wonder if it's caught YOU doing something and you're looking for some way to discredit the video evidence... looks like I'm not alone in my "curiosity"...

 

Thanks for the reply. This is helpful.

 

This is just a matter of personal curiosity about a criminal case which was covered on TV. I've been reading a book about the case.

 

The video from the camera in question figured heavily in the conviction of this person. The time on this camera was 12 minutes behind the hotel system CCTV camera time. It apparently was rigged to spy on this particular person. It was right outside his room and focused on the door.

 

I assume that it was monitored from someone's computer as it was not a part of the hotel's regular security system.

[Soundy 1]

Given the size, then, my suspicion would be that it's recording internally - someone mounted it, turned it on, then removed the storage (probably SD card) to extract the video when they had the footage they needed.

[NotoriousBRK 0]

Well as the others have said, we're not psychic, so the best anyone can give is an educated guess... and mine would be that this is a custom-built covert camera. The two circular areas on the bottom would be the standard conduit knockouts, and they appear to be intact - I would expect the lens to be behind that sloppily-cut pentagonal hole in the front. Someone probably just put the box there, mounted a small (probably board-type) camera inside of it, and cut a hole for the lens in the cover plate.

 

If that's a 12x12 box, it's possible there's an internal recorder, although I suspect it's more likely simply wired into the existing system. If you can see the screen, it should be easy to tell if this camera is displayed there. I wouldn't expect it to be wireless, as there still needs to be power run to the thing anyway.

 

Since this all started with the timestamp question and then wanting to know if this camera would have the same time as the rest of them, I have to wonder if it's caught YOU doing something and you're looking for some way to discredit the video evidence... looks like I'm not alone in my "curiosity"...

 

Thanks for the reply. This is helpful.

 

This is just a matter of personal curiosity about a criminal case which was covered on TV. I've been reading a book about the case.

 

The video from the camera in question figured heavily in the conviction of this person. The time on this camera was 12 minutes behind the hotel system CCTV camera time. It apparently was rigged to spy on this particular person. It was right outside his room and focused on the door.

 

I assume that it was monitored from someone's computer as it was not a part of the hotel's regular security system.

 

I'm aware of several hotel scenarios where cameras installed for a specific purpose (eg: to monitor a specific guest or area) are NOT part of the standard CCTV system. These cameras are intended to be covert in appearance (though most are easily spotted hacks like this one) to both guests AND the standard security personnel.

 

There will be a very small group of people aware of the camera, depending on what is being investigated. If it's an internal hotel issue (eg: suspected housekeeper theft) then only the head of security may be aware of it.

 

Recording could be done within the camera itself (SD card), to a small mini DVR or NVR device installed in the same enclosure as the camera, to a DVR/NVR that is near the camera (tossed up in the drop ceiling is common), or to a remote recording device carried as an analog or IP signal. In several of the cases I've been involved with if an IP camera is used it is kept completely off any normal networks to prevent it from being accidentally discovered or tampered with.

 

Given the vast supply of products on the market it would be silly to speculate the state of components in a generic enclosure. This is the Schroedingers Cat of security camera systems It could be an analog camera, an IP camera. It could be just an image sensor cabled back to the "camera" electronics (seen that done more than once), it could even be a small FLIR TAU module (unlikely in this case, but possible).

 

Since you don't want to supply any more details of the case, the book, the TV coverage, etc. the only thing anyone can say is that it could be anything you can possibly imagine.

[janiegh 0]

Quote from Notorious BRK:

 

Recording could be done within the camera itself (SD card), to a small mini DVR or NVR device installed in the same enclosure as the camera, to a DVR/NVR that is near the camera (tossed up in the drop ceiling is common), or to a remote recording device carried as an analog or IP signal. In several of the cases I've been involved with if an IP camera is used it is kept completely off any normal networks to prevent it from being accidentally discovered or tampered with.

 

Can you tell from this picture, taken from the video, what type of recording device was used with the covert camera? Or could it have been any one of the types you mentioned above?

 

How difficult would it be to open the junction box that had the camera inside? Would it just snap open?

[tomcctv 187]

This is just a matter of personal curiosity about a criminal case which was covered on TV. I've been reading a book about the case.

 

 

you dont name the book/// you dont name the news clip.

 

Can you tell from this picture, taken from the video, what type of recording device was used with the covert camera?

 

 

now you have footage. ????

 

How difficult would it be to open the junction box that had the camera inside? Would it just snap open?

 

 

and NOW you want to take it apart... its a bloody good book your reading.

 

its covert its there and i think thats all the info you should get.

[Soundy 1]

Can you tell from this picture, taken from the video, what type of recording device was used with the covert camera? Or could it have been any one of the types you mentioned above?

The only thing you can tell for sure is that it's NOT a megapixel camera. Any of the other possibilities still apply.

 

How difficult would it be to open the junction box that had the camera inside? Would it just snap open?

Take out the four screws in the corners.

 

This is the Schroedingers Cat of security camera systems

Ahhhh, so then it MUST be connected with Schroedinger's Cat5e... *rimshot*

[janiegh 0]

Since there seems to be a lot of curiosity about which case it is, here's the answer.

 

It's about the Stephany Flores murder in Peru. Joran van der Sloot has recently been sentenced to a 28 year prison sentence for the murder.

 

The most significant piece of evidence against him is the video from this covert camera.

 

Most people who know about this case have very strong opinions about it. And I was looking for some unbiased opinions.

 

The name of the book is Portrait of a Monster which gives you a pretty good idea about the public perception of the case.

[tomcctv 187]

why did you not put your reasons why when asked about your interest.

 

 

i found 3 lots of video from the hotel of which there are two time stamps. so this could mean they have 2 DVRs and you will see a small time difference. may have covert for staff and another system for public.

 

cctv has played a big part with this guy. 2 girls dead who were with him and a 3rd not yet confessed

[janiegh 0]

why did you not put your reasons why when asked about your interest.

 

 

i found 3 lots of video from the hotel of which there are two time stamps. so this could mean they have 2 DVRs and you will see a small time difference. may have covert for staff and another system for public.

 

cctv has played a big part with this guy. 2 girls dead who were with him and a 3rd not yet confessed

 

This is a good part of the reason why I didn't identify the case. Anyone who has heard about it from media reports assumes that he is guilty of all the terrible things he has been accused of. I think it's a lot more complicated than that.

 

In the Flores case, it was claimed by the media that this covert video camera was a part of the hotel CCTV system. That obviously is not true. There was a monitor in the hotel lobby showing screens for the 16 camera hotel security system.

 

This covert camera was placed specifically to monitor his door. Who put it there and why is a big question. Who retrieved the video from the camera and gave it to the police? Could the video have been altered before the police received it? Lots of questions.

 

I'm really not interested in discussing the case itself. There are lots of forums for discussions about that.

 

I am just trying to find some factual information about the covert video camera.