Q-See 1/3" CMOS vs 1/4" CCD? $20 difference.. which to get?

[quidpro 0]

Shopping around for an entry level system and will start out with a Costco Q-See QT428 and 4 cameras.

 

Now back in the day I remember CMOS was always for the "cheap" cameras and CCD was the only way to go. They have the QT428 bundled with either the 1/3" CMOS or 1/4" CCD, the CMOS being $20 more.

 

I've seen the night shots from Mike_VA on the CMOS camera and they look decent at night. But how do these cameras or similar spec'd cameras perform during daylight?

 

Any input is appreciated.

[mike_va 0]

Can wash out a bit in the afternoon sun. One with the cat is 830 in the morning. If you are getting them from Costco you can always return.

[quidpro 0]

Mike,

 

Thanks for the sample grabs. It's a newb question, but would you see this washout on the CCDs as well.

 

I guess what I am asking is what are the pros/cons of a 1/3" CMOS vs. 1/4" CCD.

 

Thanks.

[SEANHAWG 1]

The best advice: Neither.

 

If you are on a strict budget, there is better stuff out there.

[mike_va 0]

Mike,

 

Thanks for the sample grabs. It's a newb question, but would you see this washout on the CCDs as well.

 

I guess what I am asking is what are the pros/cons of a 1/3" CMOS vs. 1/4" CCD.

 

Thanks.

With these inexpensive cameras there is not an answer, short of trying them. Then post some pics of what you discover/learn.

 

Yes you can see washout on cheapo's and even good ones. The question is can you still get a good picture which has a lot to do with dynamic range. Cheap whatever is not going to deal well with backlighting or other extreme lighting examples. Can you make it work? Probably, you will need to play with your setup a bit when you get it as you learn.

 

FWIW I've seen that CMOS camera outperform quite a few 1/3" CCD. Anyway, it's a decent camera at a bargain price. Is someone going to be installing these at airports? No way.

 

Random thoughts you might not see advertised (confuses the consumer, as there always seems to be an exception):

 

Colors are not as good on CMOS generally, although some of my Axis cams are 1/4" CMOS and can actually do better colors than CCD. Contrast is not as good on CMOS though. CCD sometimes blows out more on car headlights, I've seen this comparing my Pan 502 to Axis P1346.

 

There can be other pros to even 1/4", at night extreme distance it is hard/very expensive to find say a 60mm f1.4 IR corrected lens for a 1/3". So, if one has a 40mm f1.4 and 1/4" CMOS the lens will let in more light than say a f1.8. In the same vein at distance 1/2" cams are even harder to find a good lens for. Problem seems to get even worse with MP lenses and IR corrected, not that many of them out there.

 

I and am sure others could provide lots of other examples both pro and con.

[rory 0]

Normally its the other way around from the manufacturers, but these might be 2 totally different actual manufacturers. Normally when prices are given from the actual manufacturer CMOS is the cheapest price, and you pay more for the CCD model - which is normally better. Basically, I would never knowingly pay for a CMOS camera for CCTV (I cant speak for IP video). Most are Sharp CMOS and the overall images normally are horrible, at least compared to the CCD models. CMOS typically will not be as sensitive under low light (although adding IR helps), have a washed out look to it, and just be difficult to get a good focus.

 

But not all cameras are made alike so ... it could vary.

[shockwave199 0]

I would get neither as well. The cameras that come bundled with that dvr are garbage, trust me. As I've mentioned in another thread I believe was you- if you like the 428 think about buying just the dvr and get other cameras.

 

These are the images I got from a qsee bundle- 420tlv 1/4" cmos. It was summer- everything nice and green and alive. I reviewed these cameras as being not too bad at first, but they really aren't acceptable, as evidenced in these shots- [TVL not mattering, for the tvl doesn't matter crowd]

 

 

Night view-

 

 

Here, even just modestly better cameras at 520tvl 1/3" CCD with better chips in them.

 

Cloudy day after rain-

 

 

Night, same camera-

 

 

Qsee 1/4" night-

 

 

Gadspot 1/3" night-

 

 

So even just a bit better budget cameras will do better for you. Good luck.

[mike_va 0]

Looking at costco, they don't even seem to carry the cams we got with our little bundle.

 

They all vary, cheap Qsee (although I would avoid any cheap camera with 1/4 CMOS and no IR cut filter) and cheap whatever. If you're going to try the route of inexpensive cams, just make sure they have a good return policy. MCM electronics (and others too) has a good return policy. Best bet though is increasing your budget a little (I'm assuming you are around 300 now).

 

Qsee does not make their cameras, many of the others do not either.

 

And as an example just to show there are always exceptions (captured a few minutes ago), here is 1/4 CMOS P1344 (not cheap) through a crap IR longpass filter (about 1/4 of the pic) about 60 yards out. You can't get that pic with any interlaced camera, cheap or otherwise.

[SEANHAWG 1]

COOL

[mike_va 0]

Bosch 495 full afternoon sun

[mike_va 0]

Here is what cheap CMOS or CCD for that matter cannot do. Indoors and outdoors correctly exposed, strong light outside. Also, this camera has black that is very black - better than Bosch etc. Also does a very good red.

 

Picked up used 75, would I rather have that or a cheap camera no contest. The Qsee bullets we have are just for overview, and mounted in spots where I don't want a big camera sticking out. The inexpensive cameras are good at close range and certain lighting situations, which is all some people need.

[quidpro 0]

Thanks for the input and information!

 

I like the QT-428... seems to have a decent rep on here and since it's fanless, should be pretty quiet. I actually grabbed a Swann D19 and while it okay... the deal breaker was two leaf-blower fans.

 

They sell the QT-428 at Costco here in Canada with either the 1/3" CMOS ($449 CAD) or 1/4" CCD ($429 CAD). I know Costco.COM in the US is selling the CCD version for $279 right now... if it was that cheap here, it would be a no brainer. But Canada is the land of scarcity, so prices are always overinflated.

 

Any idea where the QT428 can be had on it's own for cheap... most places I've seen, the price of the DVR alone is more expensive than a bundle from Costco!

[Mavrik 0]

Sometimes one can reduce 'washout' by shading the lens from sun rays. This could be as simple as foil tape on top of the lens.

 

In this pic, the round spots is from the sun hitting the lens.

 

[camera-newbie 0]

This is one of the camera sets I've been steering my wife away from buying at the local Sam's Club/Costco and even saw some at the local Microcenter store last weekend as they seem to be returned a fair amount (at least at costco) and likely are not good candidates for many situations.. This is exactly the reason I'm still doing my homework so I don't end up buying stuff only to find it's unacceptable for my needs.. It all bubbles down to that old phrase -- you get what you pay for..

 

I'll admit that I've been all over the map on cameras starting with IP's but now leaning towards analog because, for me, I want more than 2 cameras and I can afford to do that with the analog stuff but not the decent (for the most part) IP equivs. YMMV.

[shockwave199 0]

While my qsee boxed set didn't provide the cameras I wanted, I do like the 408 dvr and it did provide cables that I have in use still. But what I have concluded is that for a residential system, buy at the very least an eight channel dvr. There's tons of info and recommendations about dvr's here to consider. The dvr is somewhat the easier part of the system to decide on. Cameras are tough. You don't need to spend mortgage payments on expensive cameras, but super cheap cameras should be avoided as well. And there are TONS of suggestions and many demo pictures now as well here. There is no need to buy boxed sets. All the pieces to give you a good, tailored system for your home can be bought separately with no trouble at all- and will likely save you money in the long run. The boxed sets are really nothing more than impulse buys when you're at the stores. A decent system will take more than a convenience package.

[quidpro 0]

I'm in Canada, but have a place in the US that i ship from Costco.com to. Ended up purchasing a QT428 with 4 1/4" CCD cameras... was on special for $279.00.

 

The cameras are probably crap, but if they work decently while I find something better... that's fine with me. I really only wanted the DVR, which was going for about the same price (without cameras) everywhere else.

[mstoetz1 0]

I have the QT428... with cmos cameras.

 

They do just "ok" inside, but outside at night, they aren't very good. Even in the daytime outside, the colors are way off. My lawn never looks green in them, and they are slightly blurry. Inside, my couch never looks the right colors... so the idea their colors are off, is accurate with these.

 

The DVR is good for the money in my opinion.

 

I've been looking for other decent cameras, and like the Speco intensifier series. Cameras can get so expensive, and especially the IP (if you go digital)... and I can't afford to spend $10K on a video system for my home.