How much bandwidth do you think an i3 or i5 Haswell handle?

[cliff369 0]

Just curious if someone has experience in how to calculate how much bandwidth a processor can handle

for IP cameras. If i use an i3 4th gen processor with like 8gb ram would it handle 30-40Mbps of bandwidth

being thrown at it from some ip cameras or would it take an i5.. just trying to not overload a small server

for 6-8 , 1-2megapixel cameras.

 

thx.

[buellwinkle 0]

One can never say because each camera is different, configured differently and software can be very, very different. So maybe with one software product you can have 16 1080P cameras on a Haswell i3 and one you can only have 6-8 1080P cameras. Also, is the same PC acting as a server only or server and display as that can make a big difference.

[jdoggg1 0]

I currently have 2 of the swann 1080p bullets and 2 hikvision 3MP domes running on blue iris. So I guess that's about 10MP or so... I've tested it on 2 of my machines:

 

Machine 1:

i5 2500k

8GB RAM

80GB SSD OS drive

1TB 7200rpm storage

 

With all cameras on max resolution and highest quality, with motion detection enabled on all of them in BI, it maxes out at 35-45%. RAM usage will spike around 1.5-2GB usage by BI.

 

Machine 2:

i7 4770k

8GB RAM

256GB SSD OS drive

3TB 7200rpm storage

 

With all cameras on max resolution and highest quality, with motion detection enabled on all of them in BI, it maxes out at 15-35%. RAM usage will spike around 1.0-1.5GB usage by BI. I think the RAM usage is reduced by the increased throughput of the rest of the system.

[voip-ninja 0]

You can go with far more cameras by using a software package that makes use of built in motion detection in the cameras versus the software doing the motion detection.

 

Also, as mentioned, there are sometimes dramatic differences in how different software packages handle things. Also, remote viewing has a cpu impact, and a different one for viewing with a thick client, thin web client, mobile device, etc.

[jdoggg1 0]

Also, as mentioned, there are sometimes dramatic differences in how different software packages handle things. Also, remote viewing has a cpu impact, and a different one for viewing with a thick client, thin web client, mobile device, etc.

 

This. In my experience the difference in viewing remotely via the BI app vs IP Cam Viewer is huge. IP Cam lags like crazy - it streams the full resolution of the camera vs BI sending compressed jpeg images. When I view on my phone, BI has about a 1 sec delay and boost the cpu usage about 10-15%. IP Cam will have no effect on CPU but will be anywhere from 1-30 second delay.

[voip-ninja 0]

Also, as mentioned, there are sometimes dramatic differences in how different software packages handle things. Also, remote viewing has a cpu impact, and a different one for viewing with a thick client, thin web client, mobile device, etc.

 

This. In my experience the difference in viewing remotely via the BI app vs IP Cam Viewer is huge. IP Cam lags like crazy - it streams the full resolution of the camera vs BI sending compressed jpeg images. When I view on my phone, BI has about a 1 sec delay and boost the cpu usage about 10-15%. IP Cam will have no effect on CPU but will be anywhere from 1-30 second delay.

 

IP Cam Viewer is simply taking the full feed from the camera and sending it to you. This takes a huge amount of bandwidth, but of course won't affect the CPU performance of the box you have doing the NVR functions. Problems with IP Cam Viewer include that you can't review recorded video.

 

When I tested ExacQVision, Avigilon, Milestone and others, remote viewing always has a cpu impact, and it also depends on if the cams are doing H.264 or MJPEG. Viewing with dedicated thick clients always seems to have the lowest impact on CPU, and viewing with mobile apps (where the images are typically being re-encoded to be sent at lower transmission rates) have the highest CPU impact.

 

Having said all of that, I am running 4 cams on a C2D 2.93ghz which is a pretty basic CPU and it's running quite well... the server is even doing 2-3 other things.

[cliff369 0]

thanks for the quick feedback!

 

i'm looking at just building my own small server box for my house and residential neighbors and expecting the viewing

to be done on regular laptop or pc in the home... I'd definitely want the cameras to support the motion detection and not

the server.

 

so, it sounds like i'd be safe with an i5 4th gen and 8gb ram then a 7200rpm storage and a handful of 1-2MP cameras.

Just trying to build a low cost server box for like $500-$600.

 

you guys rock on this board.

[voip-ninja 0]

thanks for the quick feedback!

 

i'm looking at just building my own small server box for my house and residential neighbors and expecting the viewing

to be done on regular laptop or pc in the home... I'd definitely want the cameras to support the motion detection and not

the server.

 

so, it sounds like i'd be safe with an i5 4th gen and 8gb ram then a 7200rpm storage and a handful of 1-2MP cameras.

Just trying to build a low cost server box for like $500-$600.

 

you guys rock on this board.

 

An i5 would be more than capable I think of doing what you are describing. Handful of 1-2 MP cams won't push even an i3, so an i5 would leave you with room for expansion.

 

Do yourself a favor and do two things;

 

1. Build the box, load the OS (I would actually recommend you go with WHS 2011 as it's $50 and is basically a stripped down MS Server 2008) and then download trial versions of all of the packages for security once you have some cams deployed. I think that picking the right software package for what you are trying to do is at least as important as camera selection.

 

2. Once you know what you're going to do, reload the box and "deploy" it with your security package of choice.

 

3. Do all of the Windows updates, software updates, etc, and then turn all that auto-update garbage off (especially the FU MS Windows auto update). You don't want your server going down for maintenance unless YOU choose to reboot it.

 

4. If you're really paranoid then you might want to deploy two drives in a RAID-1 configuration so that the loss of a disk drive won't take your security recording box out of commission.

 

Good luck. Sounds like a fun DIY if you like this kind of stuff.

[ak357 0]

 

so, it sounds like i'd be safe with an i5 4th gen and 8gb ram then a 7200rpm storage and a handful of 1-2MP cameras.

Just trying to build a low cost server box for like $500-$600.

 

you guys rock on this board.

Another example for you

24 cam all 2mP

Avigilon cameras and software

[buellwinkle 0]

IP Cam Viewer uses the second stream by default on cameras that multi-stream, so no, it's not sending the full main stream to it. I usually set my second stream to D1 resolution and 5 fps so I can view them on my phone without problems.

 

Avigilon, Exacq, Milestone, ACT NVR3 can use the camera's motion detect abilities but may not be possible with all cameras. For example, with Milestone and my ACTi cameras, 1% is possible as a server only, but then start adding in Dahua and Hikvision drives it up to 7-8% but that's as a server only. Start using the same PC to view, then the CPU goes up a bunch, like 50% on my first gen i3 with 4 cameras. But I rarely view from the same PC, so not an issue.

[voip-ninja 0]

Thanks for the clarification on IP Cam Viewer. That it can't do any playback (which is understandable) limits its usefulness for me.

[jdoggg1 0]

The swanns don't dual stream, AFAIK. I've not found any documentation on how to do it. Looking at the footage on my Galaxy Nexus, I can tell you with certainty that it's not using the sub-stream by default on the swanns. I've not set-up the Hikvisions on IP CAM since I updated the IP addresses, so I can't speak to those yet.

[MaxIcon 0]

As others have said, it really depends on the VMS you plan on using. Some, like Blue Iris, can require a lot of resources. Others that are only recorders/servers, and not clients, can use very low CPU for a lot of cams.

 

My main experience is with Blue Iris, and here's what you need to take into account:

 

- Camera resolution - higher resolution increases CPU load dramatically

- Frame rate - higher frame rate increases CPU load dramatically

- Number of cameras doesn't matter as much as total MP and fps loads

- Motion detect and pre-trigger frames increase CPU load a medium amount

- Connecting remote clients increases CPU load a medium amount

- Bit rate doesn't have a huge effect

- Recording can increase CPU load a good bit, if not using direct-to-disk

- Use of direct-to-disk recording reduces CPU load, sometimes dramatically, but removes some options like overlays

 

This will be different for each system, but in general, it's important to specify number of cams, frame rate, and resolution as a starter.

[buellwinkle 0]

The swanns don't dual stream, AFAIK.

 

Oh man, you got short changed. You should have gotten the Hikvision ones because they definitely dual stream. It's defined under Configuration --> Video/Audio --> Stream Type --> Sub Stream.

 

I have not tried IP Cam Viewer with Hikvision, but with Dahua, I'm sure it's using the sub stream because it's 16:9 aspect ratio and my main stream is 4:3 aspect ratio and it's displaying the 16:9 view which looks different than when I log into the camera via the web browser. Using a Samsung S4 if that makes a difference.

[jdoggg1 0]

The swanns don't dual stream, AFAIK.

 

Oh man, you got short changed. You should have gotten the Hikvision ones because they definitely dual stream. It's defined under Configuration --> Video/Audio --> Stream Type --> Sub Stream.

Both options are available, however it seems to be capable of only one or the other. That's actually why I started the thread about flashing thr SWANN firmware to the Hikvision. In your review on your site, were you able to get the costco swanns to dual stream? I purchased them primarily based off that review/video. (Love your site, by the way)

[buellwinkle 0]

You select which stream you want to configure at that point, not the one you want to see. There's definitely two streams as I can view them via VLC Media Player with rtsp://192.168.0.84:554//Streaming/Channels/1 in my case for the main stream and rtsp://192.168.0.84:554//Streaming/Channels/2 for the sub stream. Not only different resolution, but again the aspect ratio is different which is apparent which stream I'm referencing besides the fact that one fills my monitor, the other one is tiny in comparison.

 

I don't have a Swann version to test with, I just borrowed one a while back to do the review.

[Razer_SE 0]

It varies wildly as many have already pointed out. I literally never even think about the processor of the computer, I had to run look at a system real quick to see what is averaged. I use Exacq, so my only choices are cameras with built in motion detection so there is no real load on the CPU. The system I looked at currently has 4 3mp cameras, and one 2 mp camera. Web server is running all the time, and being fed to a remote viewing location.

 

CPU is an i3, with only 2gb of ram. With the client loaded and viewing 4 3mp cams at once I'm at 28% CPU usage and with the client closed, but still recording and such in the background as a service I was from 1% to 3% CPU use when watched over five minutes. Ram use was 48% with client running, 40% without. Running Windows 7.

 

I'll have better example on Monday as I will install the rest of the cameras then, I'll have 9 total 3 mp cameras and the one 2mp camera, along with 5 analog cameras all hooked up and running. I'll also see what it is with and without the client running so you get a good idea of usage with 29 mp going through it!

 

I've no clue what that would require for CPU if it were not camera side, but I'm sure it would not be good!

[jdoggg1 0]

You select which stream you want to configure at that point, not the one you want to see. There's definitely two streams as I can view them via VLC Media Player with rtsp://192.168.0.84:554//Streaming/Channels/1 in my case for the main stream and rtsp://192.168.0.84:554//Streaming/Channels/2 for the sub stream. Not only different resolution, but again the aspect ratio is different which is apparent which stream I'm referencing besides the fact that one fills my monitor, the other one is tiny in comparison.

 

I don't have a Swann version to test with, I just borrowed one a while back to do the review.

Well you were right - I've never worked with RTSP before. For dual streams, will that URL work with http/https too or just RTSP formatted addresses?