Samsung SCO-2080R Wavy Lines

[vmgtlexi 0]

What gives? Watch the whole 1 minute of video.

 

BNC video connections are fine/tight.

 

Any suggestions as to cause?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKCfkLKXayk

 

ZKCfkLKXayk

[nDAlk90 0]

Looks like a defective camera.

 

You have had problems with the Samsung cameras for a while now; how much longer are you going to keep playing with it before sending in for warranty?

[vmgtlexi 0]

I'm just hopeful it's a simple power supply problem, because I don't want to get on ladders to take them down.

 

Tonight, I have one of the Samsung's on a dedicated 24VAC plug in wall adapter. Thus, my 12VDC 5A PSU is now only powering 4 cameras. If I still experience problems, then I will have no choice but to send them in.

[nDAlk90 0]

Good Luck!

[vmgtlexi 0]

Thank you.

 

I had a horrible thought that it could be a ground loop.

[rory 0]

what cable is used for video and power?

where is everything powered?

is it run anywhere near high voltage?

what type of connectors?

did you make any changes just before this started?

any other workers been there?

 

disconnect all cameras and power all down except this problem camera, see if it is okay then. If it is, add each camera back in until it starts to do it again.

 

Reset power to cameras, does it do it right away or does it take a while?

 

Restart DVR, does it do it right away or does it take a while?

 

Did you switch it on the DVR to another channel yet?

Check connectors, check power connections.

[mike_va 0]

Good suggestions from Rory, also are you running fluorescent or white LED? I have one camera that does that with a certain LED light.

 

5 of those on a 12V 5A supply sounds a little ambitious. Here's why. They have DC-DC converters in them. As the voltage drops (i.e. line drop getting to the camera), they will pull even more current from the PS. Just the way they work. Put it on an adjustable supply and you will readily see this effect. So they may be pulling more than the spec'd ~0.7A ea (rounding here out of laziness).

 

If you had a cheapo 12V only usually they linear reg the 12V down to what is needed - and you will not see this effect.

 

The other thing is derating. It sounds like you have 5 cameras on a 5A supply? That's 0.66A, which technically is fine but if there is a surge when the IR kicks on you may be putting the supply into current limit. Or that in combination with low line. The other possibility is that you have an interaction with the switchers. There are conditions where they can become marginally stable, thus your idea of trying a dedicated 24VAC is a good one.

 

The last thing are those 12V supplies themselves, some of those ebay specials are not designed to reject noise etc (probably not even UL, let alone CE etc). You may have garbage coming in on your line not rejected, or it may be creating noise. I would really use 24VAC, and keep that on a UPS with line reg. I do not like those supplies - you don't want that to be the weakest link. A good transformer is much more reliable than a switcher designed and manufactured who knows where. Unless you are buying a brand name with a good qualification program gooood luck

 

Might be a ground loop too. You'll just need to start with the simplest thing and add to it to see where you get a problem.

[tomcctv 187]

What gives? Watch the whole 1 minute of video.

 

BNC video connections are fine/tight.

 

Any suggestions as to cause?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKCfkLKXayk

 

 

 

apart from the wavy lines ... now you have a good image (now the power is right) the best so far from all your posts.

 

 

but i do wish you had gone for the power supplies that were recomended to you in the other post.

 

as you can see from your new video (centre of screen) you can see it pulsing this is a sign of a unregulated power supply. which are not good for cctv

[vmgtlexi 0]

This SCO-2080R with the "wavy lines" is not the same SCO that had the power-off problems. It is the same model, but I have two SCO-2080R's.

 

One has/had the power-off problems. This other one has the "wavy lines" issues.

 

The one with the "wavy lines" ONLY has these wavy lines during the middle of the night!!!???!! Although it only started happening a few days ago, I can ONLY find evidence of the "wavy lines" during night time.

 

And, this camera is set to color only (no B&W and no IR LED's are ever used).

 

The camera with the power-off issues has not had that problem in over 48 hours. Last night, the camera with the power-off issues was on an Altronix plug-in 24VAC transformer (2A). So, it was not on my PSU. I also disconnected all cams from my PSU except the porch cam with the wavy lines and one other critical camera (critical for security).

 

So, last night, my 5A 12VDC PSU only had 2 cams on it. Yet, this porch cam still had the "wavy lines".

 

The LED's on the SCO-2080R are called "black LED's" I think.

 

My PSU is by Bolide Technology; it's called a "switching" PSU, I believe. My other cameras (Nuvicos) never have ANY problems; and, I never had any camera problems until I installed the Samsung cameras.

 

Anyway, it seems like the "power-off" problem on one Samsung has at least for now gone away, but the "wavy lines" on the other Samsung have taken its place as the problem du jour.

 

I have ordered a 24VAC 12.5A PSU from Altronix; it may be money wasted, but at least I will be able to 100% rule out power supply being part of the problem once I put the camera on that kind of "horsepower".

[vmgtlexi 0]

To clarify...

 

Last night, my system was as follows:

 

One Samsung SCO-2080R powered by a dedicated plug-in Altronix 24VAC 50va (2A) transformer

- did not exhibit any problems last night; this was the cam that previously was powering down inexplicably

 

One Samsung SCO-2080R in color mode only (No IR) powered by my 12VDC 5A PSU

- exhibited the "wavy lines" last night; this cam had been 100% fine up until when the other Samsung stopped having its power down issues; then the power "problem" on the first Samsung stopped and this wavy line problem began

 

One Nuvico bullet IR that draws 1A powered by my 12VDC 5A PSU

 

The other cams were totally disconnected from power.

 

The "wavy lines" only occur at night.

[vmgtlexi 0]

Tonight, I may try to put the camera with the "wavy lines" on the 24VAC 50VA Altronix plug-in dedicated transformer to see if I have a repeat of the symptoms on that cam with that power supply.

 

However, using that transformer at the camera location would be nearly impossible (no place to plug in even with extension cord).

 

So, can I use the transformer at the end of my cable run (about 110' feet away). In other words, will that still be a good test; ie, will there be too much risk of voltage drop at that distance, or is 24VAC plenty capable of transmitting enough juice over that run?

[SEANHAWG 1]

or is 24VAC plenty capable of transmitting enough juice over that run?

 

Yes, alot better than 12V DC.

 

If it happens only at night then it sounds like it used more amps at that time. How do you know the camera is not using IR at this time. Just because the area is lit up with a porch light and just because it is in "color mode" doesnt mean the IR lights arent coming on. The IR lights come on by a photocell that is on the IR board and whenever the lights drop to a certain level, those IR lights come on regardless of what mode you have the camera in. My guess is that you IR is actually coming on, hence the extra amperage pull, hence the wavy lines. Its an amperage problem due to your IR lights coming on. And I bet that your voltage at the camera during that load is significantly lower than 12V. As mike said, 24 VAC should reduce the problem. Or you can always move a 12V power supply closer to the camera.

[vmgtlexi 0]

Thanks Sean.

 

When I installed and set up the camera, I selected "color only". From the manual my understanding is that this necessarily eliminates the possibility of IR coming on. IR only comes on when the camera switches to B&W mode. Maybe I'm wrong about that, but that's what the manual implies.

[Old Car Guy 0]

At first, I was going to suggest that heaters might be drawing a lot of power. But to my surprise, I found that the manual doesn’t say the camera has heaters. As for the IR, you may want to read the b/w mode section again. Not sure but you may have to turn the IR off in the b/w mode settings and not just rely on color only mode to keep the IR from coming on. I would also agree with those above that using a 24v power supply is the only way to go with that camera.

[SEANHAWG 1]

I would doubt that the IR is controlled from the OSD as I have seen very few cameras that are. Dont get me wrong, some are, but most of the time they are not. Most of the time, the IR function and mechanism is seperate from the camera functions totally and the IR is as simple as turning on whenever the lights go below a certain level and I bet that this is happening. The only time I have seen IR that can be controlled by the OSD is on cameras that have "Smart IR"

 

This is the only logical explanation for your current problem as there would really be no other reason for your cameras have wavey lines at night other than an amperage pull or voltage drop and the only thing that can be causing that is extra load, that extra load has got to be caused by your IR's coming on. One of our older cameras do the same exact thing right now, except the extra load is from the heaters inside the housing as opposed to IR, but I get wavy lines just like you.

[Old Car Guy 0]

With this camera the IR on and off is controlled on a OSD in the b/w mode settings. It also looks like this camera does have some kind of smart IR.

[vmgtlexi 0]

The way the manual presents the info about IR, it appears that if the user sets the camera to "color" being on all the time, the IR does not ever come on. And, I have the camera set to "color" only.

 

Also, in looking at my current night image of the camera, there is no indication of IR being on. The light on the porch is from my pretty powerful landscape lights.

 

Here's a snapshot. If IR were on, I would expect to see the IR reflecting off the many white surface, like I do in my other cameras. I am pretty sure this camera never has IR come on. So, there would (hopefully) not be excess current draw for this camera.

 

Anyway, the "big" test is tonight. I have this camera on a dedicated Altronix 24VAC 2A plug-in wall transformer. So, it has: 1) plenty of power and 2) is removed from my common PSU. So, if it has the "wavy lines" again tonight, I can start to feel pretty certain that it was not my PSU causing the problem, and it's more likely a camera or ground loop issue.

Edited October 24, 2011 by Guest

[vmgtlexi 0]

I meant to attach the photo referenced in my post above....here it is:

 

I don't see any evidence of IR.

 

[vmgtlexi 0]

That being said, I am really HOPING that being on a dedicated power supply eliminates the problem....because putting in a more powerful PSU is much more appealing to me than trying to un-install these cameras to send them in for warranty work and/or trying to hunt down and solve a ground loop issue.

 

Keep your fingers crossed.

[SEANHAWG 1]

Yeah I looked at the manual and I see what you mean but I still dont think there is a way to completely turn it off. I think there is a way to dim it down and/or make it like smart IR. It says its a winner DSP, I have a camera with the same DSP and I'll check tomorrow. I am almost 99% positive that the IR cannot be completely turned off. Whenever you turn it on IR mode, that simply means it is turning on "Smart IR". I could be wrong but I'll check and make sure.

[SEANHAWG 1]

There are 2 reasons why you cant see IR in that picture

 

#1) You have lights on on your porch and there would be no way to see the IR in that picture

#2) Your IR cut filter is blocking out the incoming IR in the camera since you have it in color mode. Still doesnt mean its not shooting out IR.

 

Turn off your lights where its real dark and go up and look up at the camera to see if you have a red glow. Cup your hands over the camera if you have to to make it real dark.

[shockwave199 0]

I meant to attach the photo referenced in my post above....here it is:

 

I don't see any evidence of IR.

 

 

But I don't see evidence of color either. I've seen this cam in your vid and that looked like color, but this shot looks BW.

[Old Car Guy 0]

Like you, I would think that color mode would turn the IR off. I’m just saying that in case it doesn’t it would be worth a try by turning the IR off in b/w mode. The bottom line is I think you have a power problem and I hope the dedicated power supply solves the problem.

[vmgtlexi 0]

I turned off my landscape lights. Here is what the porch looks like with the camera in "color only" mode. The very tiny bit of ambient light you see is from a powerful gas light in my yard about 20-25' away.

 

I also looked at the lens and did not see any hint of the IR lights being on. I am convinced there is no IR usage when the camera is set by the user to be in "color only" mode.

 

However, I hear your suggestions and appreciate the thought process. These are all great ideas, and are very helpful to me in checking all possibilities. So, I am greatly indebted for all of the ongoing discussion.

 

[vmgtlexi 0]

Shockwave - On my main monitor, you can see the color better. But, this image was taken from my remote network access and likely degraded through that process. Also, it is a very dark red paint on the wall of the porch and the floor tiles are dark too. Probably at night they give a "B&W" feel even though there is some color.