mnm99 0 Posted May 3, 2012 I have a few questions about night vision cameras. I'm trying to set up my house with a 8 camera system. The first thing I'm doing is trying to pick a good camera. I'm running into a problem though and don't know if this is normal. I guess my first question is..I bought 2 cameras to start , one pionting at my driveway and one at my front door. The first camera I bought was this one with 600lines and 32IR http://www.active-vision.com/dome-camera-vandal-p/acc-v04n-h4d-w.htm Daytime it looks great, night time it has A LOT of snow. even with the IR on. I am viewing this through my TV also ( yellow video port ) If I turn my outside lights on it clears up. Why is it so bad? Voltage is good, cable , connectors ect.. Would it look better through a DVR? Now #2... I tried everything thinking these were garbage cameras, so I went and returned them for these http://www.active-vision.com/day-night-dome-camera-p/acc-v10n-vhvd.htm SPECS.. •1/3” Sony ExView HAD II CCD •Super High 700 TVL Resolution •Stalight 0.001 Low Lux •2.8~12mm Vari-focal Lens •OSD Configuration Menu •Dual Voltage, 12vDC or 24vAC •Vandal Proof SAME thing..image looks good during the day and real snowy at night. Am I expecting too much or should it go through a DVR to be converted to Digital for a true picture? Thanks for your help. I'm going to try to post pics. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 4, 2012 Nobody huh? Well I talked to the dealer and he had me try some settings on the camera. No good.... I'm returning them and am going to try a 42IR 700res dome. It is supposed to have a tone of adjustments also. We'll see I guess. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shockwave199 0 Posted May 4, 2012 It's hard to just say get a good sensitive camera in low light because I think it may be more than that. It may be that you're blowing up what might be an acceptable amount of noise to such an extent that it's unaccetable looking. It may be the camera just isn't giving you a strong IR wash. Or it could be crap cameras with really weak IR's no matter how many they shove in there. Hard to say except I think it's got to do with a direct component input to the tv doing that and I don't think buying an ever more expensive camera with more menu options will really solve anything the way you're hooking them up. You might be better putting money into a dvr with HDMI or VGA to the tv if that's what you want. But as you see, in general it's best to actually provide exterior light to help the camera see in the dark. It's good for the camera and good for deterrant. Sometimes IR can be helpful but in all eight of my cameras, I've found the only truely useable and powerful IR is in my ptz with only eight IR leds- but those suckers make some serious light when called on. And mostly I don't call on them. A good sensitive camera in low light without IR is a good thing. As to your problem, I don't know- wait for more suggestions before dumping more money out. Good luck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
groovyman 0 Posted May 4, 2012 The camera is connected directly to the TV, correct? Many times with these types of cameras the image is black & white with just the IR. Is there a setting in the TV for B&W? Try turning down the color saturation on the TV and see if that helps. I ran into this problem when viewing B&W time lapse VHS video on a VCR connected to a video capture card on my computer (I did this to digitize the VHS video). I turned down the color saturation to zero and it worked fine then. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the toss 0 Posted May 4, 2012 Your TV is only displaying the signal it receives from your camera. Obviously with adequate light you get a reasonable picture. So it would seem the problem is signal quality when operating under IR conditions. Have you checked the camera voltage when the IR is on ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 4, 2012 The camera is connected directly to the TV, correct? Many times with these types of cameras the image is black & white with just the IR. Is there a setting in the TV for B&W? Try turning down the color saturation on the TV and see if that helps. I ran into this problem when viewing B&W time lapse VHS video on a VCR connected to a video capture card on my computer (I did this to digitize the VHS video). I turned down the color saturation to zero and it worked fine then. I tried that , Thanks. Still no good Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 4, 2012 Your TV is only displaying the signal it receives from your camera. Obviously with adequate light you get a reasonable picture. So it would seem the problem is signal quality when operating under IR conditions. Have you checked the camera voltage when the IR is on ? Yea the camera voltage is set right at 12.3v. I can adjust it +-10% I ended up getting ANOTHER camera....Here's some of the specs on this one. -Image sensor---1/3" Color Sony CCD / Sony DSP -700 TV Lines -0 LUX with IR -42 IR -Vari-focal 2.8-12mm -33 to 79 degrees -NTSC 1/60 - 1/100,000 -S/N more than 48db -White balance Auto -Gain control Auto -Sync system internal The camera has a knob on the power/video cable that has a bunch of fine tune adjustments also. We'll see.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
camera-newbie 0 Posted May 4, 2012 It doesn't seem like the IR is even turned on -- or the LEDs are REALLY weak-- I'd bet with a decent IR illuminator the camera would work great at night -- of course a decent illuminator may cost more than the camera did (I didn't look at the price but am guessing). Just my 0.02 worth.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 4, 2012 It doesn't seem like the IR is even turned on -- or the LEDs are REALLY weak-- I'd bet with a decent IR illuminator the camera would work great at night -- of course a decent illuminator may cost more than the camera did (I didn't look at the price but am guessing). Just my 0.02 worth.. The pictures posted are with a non IR camera. It was a .001 LUX starlight. The new cameras are on my last post. Going to try them tonight. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MaxIcon 0 Posted May 4, 2012 According to the web page, the starlight cam only goes to 1/60 second shutter speed, which is pretty fast for very low light. If it could go to 1/30, you'd probably see some improvement with minimal motion blur. Below that, the image quality will generally improve a lot, but motion blur becomes a problem. A 1/2" sensor camera with a fast lens would help, but would cost a good bit more. It's not easy to get great low-light performance without throwing some money at the problem or going with IR (which has its own issues, as you'll find out). Motion detect security lights can be a good compromise, if they're practical. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horizon 0 Posted May 5, 2012 Hi mnm99. Not intending to insult by this, but are you measuring the voltage at the camera end, not at the powersupply? Reason is that you'll want to see how much voltage is dropped over the cable. With IR on, this could be significant. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 6, 2012 Hi mnm99. Not intending to insult by this, but are you measuring the voltage at the camera end, not at the powersupply? Reason is that you'll want to see how much voltage is dropped over the cable. With IR on, this could be significant. Your not insulting me. Just trying to help. Yes I checked at the camera. I had 12.3 or so. I installed the new cameras. It is a much better picture. There is a SLIGHT grain in the picture at night, but that was at TOTAL darkness. I mean, overcast with no light on anywhere and I was able to make out faces near my vehicles. Overall I could live with the last ones I picked. The daytime pictures are very clear too. It would be nice if the camera spread out the IR a little though. I'm new to the CCTV thing and I just think that would help for a wider view. Maybe down the road I'll get an external IR or something If I neew more, or just leave all my outside lights on..LOL. Anyway thanks for your help. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vector18 1 Posted May 6, 2012 I wonder why your starlight camera picture did not show color during night vision? With non IR cameras with starlight, you remain in color rather than b+w like IR cameras. Also, when choosing a night vision camera, it is a good idea to get one with more than 52db s/n ratio. That means there will be less signal to noise ratio when in night vision. Another good option is to look for 2dnr or 3dnr which is digital noise reduction. Basically, when a camera is in b+w, it's resolution goes higher and more info is being sent to the DVR which causes noise. If you have a high s/n ration and DNR, the camera prevents that snowy grainy effect. And one more thing to keep in mind, what is the recording and/or viewing resolution of the DVR? If you have an awesome camera with a piece of crap DVR thats recording in very low res, when you view that camera on your big TV, it's blowing it up so much to fit the screen, the resolution just turns to crap. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 7, 2012 I wonder why your starlight camera picture did not show color during night vision? With non IR cameras with starlight, you remain in color rather than b+w like IR cameras. Also, when choosing a night vision camera, it is a good idea to get one with more than 52db s/n ratio. That means there will be less signal to noise ratio when in night vision. Another good option is to look for 2dnr or 3dnr which is digital noise reduction. Basically, when a camera is in b+w, it's resolution goes higher and more info is being sent to the DVR which causes noise. If you have a high s/n ration and DNR, the camera prevents that snowy grainy effect. And one more thing to keep in mind, what is the recording and/or viewing resolution of the DVR? If you have an awesome camera with a piece of crap DVR thats recording in very low res, when you view that camera on your big TV, it's blowing it up so much to fit the screen, the resolution just turns to crap. The camera showed color. Look the the left at the grass. Truck is gray like the driveway. Don't have a DVR yet. Trying to get the cameras figured out befor a DVR. This is the DVR I was looking at though. http://www.active-vision.com/16Camera-Digital-Video-Recorder-p/sx-414-16.htm Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vector18 1 Posted May 7, 2012 Just keep in mind that 599.00 price is without a hard drive. As far as the dvr itself goes, the website only tells us the compression is h.264 and it's 30fps. It does not tell us local recording resolution and streaming resolution. These days, it's best to get at least D1 for local recording at at LEAST CIF for streaming. If your not watching the cameras on your smart phone or remote viewing, you can only worry about local recording. Also, are you watching the cameras on your HD TV? Than it would be even nicer if the dvr had an HDMI output, which alot of them do these days. Before purchasing that dvr, which is still alot of money to be spending, make sure it's going to provide everything that you want. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 7, 2012 I was told it recorded in D1. I'd like to see all the specs also. He was installing a 1TB hard drive for a total price of $699. Is there a $700 DVR you would recommend? Other options are sure on the table. Thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tomcctv 187 Posted May 7, 2012 I was told it recorded in D1. I'd like to see all the specs also. He was installing a 1TB hard drive for a total price of $699. Is there a $700 DVR you would recommend? Other options are sure on the table. Thanks hi. i would look for a D1 dvr. there is no mention of your link being D1 ---30fps i would say its a CIF unit also for that money why does it not have links to iphone or android apps. (what apps does it use) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnm99 0 Posted May 7, 2012 I was told it recorded in D1. I'd like to see all the specs also. He was installing a 1TB hard drive for a total price of $699. Is there a $700 DVR you would recommend? Other options are sure on the table. Thanks hi. i would look for a D1 dvr. there is no mention of your link being D1 ---30fps i would say its a CIF unit What FPS does a D1 run? Any good sites to look? also for that money why does it not have links to iphone or android apps. (what apps does it use) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
