HiroPro 0 Posted May 13, 2012 I can't believe you're installing corporate stuff and appear to not even be able to calculate bps and calculate per minute in your OP. UGG No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! This coming from a guy who thinks he can sell Genetec and Axis to home owners and small business users ROFL pull putting Axis M10 cameras in elevators with UBNT wireless links....WOW " title="Applause" /> What's wrong with using Axis M11s or M10s for home and small business use? I'm not sold on Genetec for this purpose but am leaning towards exacqVision and Avigilon. As for the elevators, what is the best way to go about doing this? I take it there is a flexible conduit that goes up and down with the elevator that you'd use riser rated cat6 with I guess right? An elevator is rather obscure and I'm sorry I don't know how to deploy that stuff YET... But dude... to be doing large scale corp and not even be competent enough to calculate bandwidth is rather pathetic don't you think! BTW please try to be constructive with your posts. Even when I'm insulted by this guy in my thread I came here to actually HELP the guy with advice as best I can. Some of you just say **** to incite and it has nothing to do with helping or educating or informing about product/solutions. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ak357 0 Posted May 13, 2012 I can't believe you're installing corporate stuff and appear to not even be able to calculate bps and calculate per minute in your OP. No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! But dude... to be doing large scale corp and not even be competent enough to calculate bandwidth is rather pathetic don't you think! What this is all about ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soundy 1 Posted May 13, 2012 I can't believe you're installing corporate stuff and appear to not even be able to calculate bps and calculate per minute in your OP. UGG No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! Did you ever think that maybe he hasn't learned this stuff is simply because it hasn't been an issue for him until now? You've been making a LOT of assumptions in ALL your posts in here, and insulting a lot of people based on those assumptions... and yet you're still asking for those same people to help you? But dude... to be doing large scale corp and not even be competent enough to calculate bandwidth is rather pathetic don't you think! BTW please try to be constructive with your posts. Anyone else note the glaring irony in these two sentences? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ssmith10pn 0 Posted May 13, 2012 Not sure about up there in Canada but in the US Elevator shafts are sacred ground. Everything in the shaft has to be in Rigid Conduit and UL Fire Rated. The only way to get video in an Elevator car is in the traveler cable. You also have to get the Elevator company involved because they are responsable for State Inspections. Typical Elevator Cameras are wide angle corner mount. Good luck finding that in an IP. That's what encoders are for. We typically use these in Stainless to match the inside of the car. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/492383-REG/Videolarm_WS6S_50NF_WS6S_50NF_Warrior_Six_Vandal_Resistant.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HiroPro 0 Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) Not sure about up there in Canada but in the US Elevator shafts are sacred ground. Everything in the shaft has to be in Rigid Conduit and UL Fire Rated.The only way to get video in an Elevator car is in the traveler cable. You also have to get the Elevator company involved because they are responsable for State Inspections. Typical Elevator Cameras are wide angle corner mount. Good luck finding that in an IP. That's what encoders are for. We typically use these in Stainless to match the inside of the car. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/492383-REG/Videolarm_WS6S_50NF_WS6S_50NF_Warrior_Six_Vandal_Resistant.html Thank you so much for this informative post. I've learned something. Thanks! PS it's hard for me to believe a suitable IP camera for this purpose doesn't exist Edited May 13, 2012 by Guest Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HiroPro 0 Posted May 13, 2012 I can't believe you're installing corporate stuff and appear to not even be able to calculate bps and calculate per minute in your OP. UGG No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! Did you ever think that maybe he hasn't learned this stuff is simply because it hasn't been an issue for him until now? You've been making a LOT of assumptions in ALL your posts in here, and insulting a lot of people based on those assumptions... and yet you're still asking for those same people to help you? But dude... to be doing large scale corp and not even be competent enough to calculate bandwidth is rather pathetic don't you think! BTW please try to be constructive with your posts. Anyone else note the glaring irony in these two sentences? OK lets stop this RIGHT NOW. My snerky response with this dude was due to him saying I'm ripping off whomever I sell the UBNT stuff to. With that being said lets forget about it and I'll try not to respond to this kind of thing in the future. I'm sorry if I've insulted anyone and it was not my intention at all. Lets move on to IP CCTV stuff! This is why we are all here right! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
groovyman 0 Posted May 13, 2012 I would see if it's possible for them to switch to a cable internet connection. Generally you get at least DOUBLE the upload speed than you do with DSL. DOH! Now why didn't I think of that. You're a god among mice Hiro. I'd also get them a decent router if they don't have one. An Asus RT-N16 with Tomato or DD-WRT is a MUST IMHO or you would purchase an Enterprise class router for what... five times the price! For what purpose? How is this going to improve upload bandwidth that is limited to 300K-500K and improve playback of recorded video via the internet at those upload speeds? I'm eagerly waiting on this answer. I can't believe you're installing corporate stuff and appear to not even be able to calculate bps and calculate per minute in your OP. You have no idea what I'm installing, if I installed it, how long ago it was installed, what the budget is, what it's used for, etc. etc. etc. Plus, there are many factors involved when calculating file sizes at different quality settings and framerates. This is not an exact science and many different variables need to be taken into account, but I guess you haven't gotten to that part in your CCTV 101 book yet. You show your immaturity with comments like that. No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! No shiit? Is that a fact. And you absolutely do mean to offend. I can read through the BS, ehh? My tone with you groovyman is somewhat motivated with your suggestions I'm ripping off my friend by dumping those UBNT cameras. You said it, not me. Just calling you out as you put yourself on such a high pedestal, then sunk to the lowest type of reseller - get rid of what you've got, because it's all that you've got. Doesn't matter if it's proper for the environment. I said nothing to the effect of ripping off your friend and everything to the effect of you trying to get rid of your own mistake by pawning it off on someone else. That's just terrible. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soundy 1 Posted May 13, 2012 BTW, No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! Do YOU? Try reading the forums a bit: even for experienced techs, bandwidth and storage calculations are a black art. There are SO many things that affect it, including, but not limited to: framerate, resolution, codec, VERSION of the codec; constant vs. variable bitrates, scene complexity, scene contrast, movement in the scene, constant vs. motion vs. alarm-triggered recording... Now for you to waltz in here and proceed to criticize and belittle someone who's also new to the industry and may not have had to deal with this aspect before, for not knowing it backward and forward already, is presumptuous and arrogant in the extreme. You'd best take a step back, boy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HiroPro 0 Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) DOH! Now why didn't I think of that. You're a god among mice Hiro. uhh... just trying to help you get more upstream bandwidth brother! For what purpose? How is this going to improve upload bandwidth that is limited to 300K-500K and improve playback of recorded video via the internet at those upload speeds? I'm eagerly waiting on this answer. It will not improve bandwidth but it does offer advanced QoS and many many other features that makes life easier. Plus it's a lot more stable and can handle a lot more concurrency than your average off the shelf router. IF you've never heard of DD-WRT of Tomato then it's fantastic info and advice IMHO. You have no idea what I'm installing, if I installed it, how long ago it was installed, what the budget is, what it's used for, etc. etc. etc. Plus, there are many factors involved when calculating file sizes at different quality settings and framerates. This is not an exact science and many different variables need to be taken into account, but I guess you haven't gotten to that part in your CCTV 101 book yet. You show your immaturity with comments like that. Yes it is an exact science and can be calculated to exact values if using CBR. VBR is a whole other ball of wax. No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! No shiit? Is that a fact. And you absolutely do mean to offend. I can read through the BS, ehh? This is a very valid point IMHO and a subject covered in computer class for grade 10 in high school. My tone with you groovyman is somewhat motivated with your suggestions I'm ripping off my friend by dumping those UBNT cameras. You said it, not me. Just calling you out as you put yourself on such a high pedestal, then sunk to the lowest type of reseller - get rid of what you've got, because it's all that you've got. Doesn't matter if it's proper for the environment. I said nothing to the effect of ripping off your friend and everything to the effect of you trying to get rid of your own mistake by pawning it off on someone else. That's just terrible. huh so the same can be said for thewireguys because he's trying to sell off some Arecont cameras? Anyway I'm sorry for upsetting anyone ok! Lets be couth and talk about this stuff in a polite manor. Lets end this right now! I know this is my last post responding to this kind of thing. I'm here to learn and share what I can with others in an attempt to help each other out in this community. Edited May 13, 2012 by Guest Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thewireguys 3 Posted May 13, 2012 huh so the same can be said for thewireguys because he's trying to sell off some Avigilon cameras? Anyway I'm sorry for upsetting anyone ok! Lets be couth and talk about this stuff in a polite manor. Ugh... You are totally clueless. I think it's best you find anther forum to go rip on people. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HiroPro 0 Posted May 13, 2012 BTW, No offense but two months of research and you don't even have a handle on bit rates and bandwidth yet! Do YOU? Try reading the forums a bit: even for experienced techs' date=' bandwidth and storage calculations are a black art. There are SO many things that affect it, including, but not limited to: framerate, resolution, codec, VERSION of the codec; constant vs. variable bitrates, scene complexity, scene contrast, movement in the scene, constant vs. motion vs. alarm-triggered recording... Now for you to waltz in here and proceed to criticize and belittle someone who's also new to the industry and may not have had to deal with this aspect before, for not knowing it backward and forward already, is presumptuous and arrogant in the extreme. You'd best take a step back, boy.[/quote'] I'm sorry to criticize the guy for not being able calculate bandwidth budget. It was in response to his insults to me. I didn't start it. I can understand storage calculations is a black art when dealing with VBR and triggered storage. Is this not obvious to anyone that understands the underpinning technology? He wasn't asking about storage calculations anyway. He was asking about streams from remote servers coming to a head office etc. I assume they are live and not triggered either. It should be a simple calculation even if it's VBR to get an average bit rate and bandwidth budget. This is really elementary isn't it! As for his responses insulting my suggestions that were just there to try to help... For that I don't know what to say! other than... LAME PS Tomato on an RT-N16 has FANTASTIC QoS features and could really help with what he's doing! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HiroPro 0 Posted May 13, 2012 Here's something IP cam vendors should be adding to their viewing software as a standard item - realtime FPS and bandwidth. The orphaned Rainbow IPM14 I'm testing does this, and it's very handy. You can call up a window from the web viewer and get the realtime FPS and BW, which makes comparing setting changes quick and easy. These really cheap UBNT cameras I'm testing have those features and it's very robust in it's reporting granularity. I thought this would be a standard feature with ACTi and Axis etc no? I'm very curious how camera triggering works with the NVR/VMS backend. Is there a standard for this sorta like OPOS for point of sale peripherals? It seems a specific driver etc built with the API for the cam is needed for the backend to be able to adjust cam parameters and receive trigger meta right? Curious the industry doesn't have some kinda open standard API for this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
