Anti - CCTV

[ljarrald 0]

you know i was thinking , how anyone would not like the idea of cameras in the public arena, then i remembered the recent murder that took place about a week ago in NYC, the murder involved a small little 8 year old boy, just in case you haven't heard about the case, the boy was on his way home from day camp, he had been asking his mom to let him walk home by himself a distance of approx. 7 blocks, and she agreed to let him walk a few blocks by himself, and she would meet him half way between home and day camp...

 

well the little boy got confused on his way home, and asked a man for help, the man offered the boy a ride home, but the boy never made it,,,about 3 days later, parts of the boys body was found in a dumpster, and the rest of the boys body, specifically his feet were found in the refrigerator of the man who offered him help when he got lost...

 

the way they found out who was the man who took the boy, and murdered him, and cut him up...was through video from a CCTV camera that was placed in an area to monitor the street...

 

so don't tell me any crap about your privacy, this little boy was slaughtered, and if not for the camera, this POS would and could still be on the street to do this again...

 

heres a link to story:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/police-volunteers-search-for-9-year-old-hasidic-brooklyn-boy-who-vanished-while-walking-home/2011/07/13/gIQAaByyBI_story.html

 

because this camera was not monitored, i would not have a problem with it. they didn't search through the footage zoming in on everyone did they? nope, just the sick man.

[ljarrald 0]

No ones against GPS tracking devices?

 

what about GSM tracking devices? (AKA mobile phones?) sure, they cant see where everyone was at a specific time, but they CAN track the whereabouts of a certain phone. we are already there...

[ljarrald 0]

CCTV definitely has it's uses, but having it everywhere is costly, and constantly watching everything everyone does anywhere in public would be an invasion of civil liberties

 

 

 

Fa chris. you do know that while you are walking down a street that has cameras the operator does not have a clue who you are. so how can it be an invasion.

 

 

most street cameras in america can be logged into by anyone. am 3500m away from DC but i can log in to any of there cameras just as i can in NY/NC/SC florida atlanta. they are put in with your money for you to also use. going on a long drive .... look at traffic (beat the jams)

 

i had this very idea! i thought it may be useful round here. i live in an OK area but at night it can be a bit dodgy, i was thinking it would be good to check if there were any dodgy types lurking around the road before i got there.

 

but what if THEY used it? what if i lived in a house that this camera over looked? what if i had pissed someone off and they wanted my head on a plate? whats to stop them logging into the camera, waiting for me to open my front door then ring a mate and give the signal to pounce?

 

what if someone is using a screen recorder at the same time that someone gets stabbed and posts it on youtube?

[ljarrald 0]

Bureacratic W@nk@rs. One good strong wind and it would probably topple over.

Still someone is making a fortune creating these monstrocities.

These cars are the LATEST craze among local authorities and I learned that my local council

have just bought one for parking enforcement, the first in the NW region.

 

If one of these turned up in my neighbourhood the crims would laugh their socks off.

 

would that be the one that monitors the bus lane and sits between blockbuster and KFC in rush hour? i don't like these very much! and i agree, whilst protests are going on, these things are sitting in a garage. though, if you took it into a protest it'd get destroyed for sure! if one person was on the roof swinging from the pole, the whole thing would fall over.

[rory 0]

WRONG! you CHOOSE to go into shops with CCTV. yes, we CHOOSE to go on the streets that have cctv, but most of the time it is the only way to get to point B. we should not be forced to be under CCTV. there is every right for wall mart and the like to have CCTV as it is a private premises!

 

i don't understand where cell phones and digital cameras come into it (unless you are talking about how they can track our phones at any time weather on or off.)

 

No I was 100% Correct - you are NOT forced to go into public.

Digital cameras are - cameras - cell phones have - cameras.

If you want to get rid of cameras in public, then you have to get rid of ALL of them, and that includes getting rid of cellphones and digital cameras.

Really though, you guys that live in your little dreamy towns with no crime might not understand, but after seeing murder after murder on the streets around here, most of which never get solved, CCTV certainly does more good than bad and would help greatly in the apprehension and prosecution of murders and rapists.

[ljarrald 0]

CCTV is just a technology. It's not good or bad. It depends on who is using it.

 

If it is private individuals and companies using it, they are employing the tech to cut down on theft, protect their house, things like that. Admirable and legitimate uses.

 

The government, on the other hand, has suspect motives. They have the goal of making money off of red-light tickets, tracking people, torturing dissenters, imprisoning kids with illegal lemonade stands, who knows. The government is full of bad people with bad ideas doing bad things. So I would rather they not have any cameras. Surveillance is a power and I want government power to be as limited and minimal as possible.

 

I was once the victim of a crime. My laptop was stolen, along with some money and other stuff. I really wished the gas station across the street had some cameras that might have seen the car that did it. Alas, they did not.

 

So surveillance is a good thing, as long as it's the people doing the surveillance, and not the rulers. Elsewise, quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

 

second that! you put that amazingly, its what i have been trying to say, just not saying properly.

 

(btw, look up and download PREY)

[ljarrald 0]

WRONG! you CHOOSE to go into shops with CCTV. yes, we CHOOSE to go on the streets that have cctv, but most of the time it is the only way to get to point B. we should not be forced to be under CCTV. there is every right for wall mart and the like to have CCTV as it is a private premises!

 

i don't understand where cell phones and digital cameras come into it (unless you are talking about how they can track our phones at any time weather on or off.)

 

No I was 100% Correct - you are NOT forced to go into public.

Digital cameras are - cameras - cell phones have - cameras.

If you want to get rid of cameras in public, then you have to get rid of ALL of them, and that includes getting rid of cellphones and digital cameras.

Really though, you guys that live in your little dreamy towns with no crime might not understand, but after seeing murder after murder on the streets around here, most of which never get solved, CCTV certainly does more good than bad and would help greatly in the apprehension and prosecution of murders and rapists.

 

so you are saying if we don't want to be spotted on CCTV we should never leave our houses?

 

digital cameras aren't recording 24/7 are they? everyone monitors what is going on around them with their own eyes. everyone in the area can see who is watching them. if a car started to speed up towards a group of pedestrians and someone whipped out a camera and pressed record then fair enough, if someone followed me around with a camera on record i would rip it out of their hands and snap the memory card in two.

 

monitored CCTV is like a 1 way mirror, we can see what its looking at, but we can't see who is looking at it!

[rory 0]

digital cameras aren't recording 24/7 are they?

Yes DVRs record 24/7

[ljarrald 0]

digital cameras aren't recording 24/7 are they?

Yes DVRs record 24/7

 

a DVR is not a digital camera though is it? (assuming we are talking about compact/SLR cameras that people carry around

[rory 0]

if someone followed me around with a camera on record i would rip it out of their hands and snap the memory card in two.

You could try that, but then they have the right to defend their property and therefore they may end up beating you to a pulp - they are not breaking the law but you are the minute you take physical action against them, hence any returned action by them is self defence - it is not illegal for them to film in a public area. Again, if you arent doing anything illegal then you have nothing to worry about. Most citizens welcome the use of CCTV in public, be it on the street, a car park, or in a store. If you dont like it, then dont go outside, have groceries delivered or drive a car with tint.

[ljarrald 0]

if someone followed me around with a camera on record i would rip it out of their hands and snap the memory card in two.

You could try that, but then they have the right to defend their property and therefore they may end up beating you to a pulp - they are not breaking the law but you are the minute you take physical action against them, hence any returned action by them is self defence - it is not illegal for them to film in a public area. Again, if you arent doing anything illegal then you have nothing to worry about. Most citizens welcome the use of CCTV in public, be it on the street, a car park, or in a store. If you dont like it, then dont go outside, have groceries delivered or drive a car with tint.

 

so really, if i don't like public cctv then the only option is to become a Muslim woman?

(no offence or racism intended)

[fa chris 0]

if someone followed me around with a camera on record i would rip it out of their hands and snap the memory card in two.

You could try that, but then they have the right to defend their property and therefore they may end up beating you to a pulp - they are not breaking the law but you are the minute you take physical action against them, hence any returned action by them is self defence - it is not illegal for them to film in a public area. Again, if you arent doing anything illegal then you have nothing to worry about. Most citizens welcome the use of CCTV in public, be it on the street, a car park, or in a store. If you dont like it, then dont go outside, have groceries delivered or drive a car with tint.

 

I'd file harassment charges.

 

Don't need the gov't harassing me too with some massive cctv system.

[rory 0]

 

so really, if i don't like public cctv then the only option is to become a Muslim woman?

(no offence or racism intended)

it certainly appears that way, in Canada and the UK at least (you saw that Canadian news report too aye?)

[Numb-nuts 1]

Your only option would be to behave yourself Isn't that the idea?

 

It's there and there isn't anything to complain about. It's a trade off between your rights and your privacy. If you want to protect your privacy 100% then don't ever go out in public.

To some extent CCTV protects your freedom, what it can't do is protect your sensibilities.

 

You can't train a dog to be nasty then complain if you get bitten once in a while but the dog will deter a lot of potential trouble.

 

I can't believe this thread is still being chewed over.

[fa chris 0]

 

You can't train a dog to be nasty then complain if you get bitten once in a while but the dog will deter a lot of potential trouble.

 

 

I can complain if I never wanted the dog in the first place but the government forced it on me.

[Numb-nuts 1]

I am really sorry for those of you that feel your freedom is being curtailed and that your privacy is being taken from you. I don't feel that way, and know that if you have strong feelings of being intruded upon, there is nothing I can say to make it better for you.

[Soundy 1]

I am really sorry for those of you that feel your freedom is being curtailed and that your privacy is being taken from you. I don't feel that way, and know that if you have strong feelings of being intruded upon, there is nothing I can say to make it better for you.

How diplomatic - are you running for office soon?

 

"I'm a politician, which means I'm a cheat and a liar, and when I'm not kissin' babies, I'm stealin' their lollipops... BUT, it also means I keep my options open."

[ljarrald 0]

went out today and spotted 3 new council cameras.

seriously! i walked less than a mile. this means that since jan, 5 have gone up. how many more do they want?

 

and whilst they are spending millions shoving cameras in everyones faces, they cut money away from services that help communities!

[nDAlk90 0]

Welcome 1984!

 

 

went out today and spotted 3 new council cameras.

seriously! i walked less than a mile. this means that since jan, 5 have gone up. how many more do they want?

 

and whilst they are spending millions shoving cameras in everyones faces, they cut money away from services that help communities!

[tomcctv 187]

and whilst they are spending millions shoving cameras in everyones faces, they cut money away from services that help communities!

 

 

is that not what they are doing. a service for the community.

[ljarrald 0]

[quote="tomcctv"][quote="ljarrald"]and whilst they are spending millions shoving cameras in everyones faces, they cut money away from services that help communities! [/quote] is that not what they are doing. a service for the community.[/quote] no, not really! nobody has actually requested these... if they kept the youth clubs open then the troublesome kids would be busy in there, not on the streets where the cctv needs to keep an eye on them.

[tomcctv 187]

no, not really! nobody has actually requested these... if they kept the youth clubs open then the troublesome kids would be busy in there, not on the streets where the cctv needs to keep an eye on them.

 

 

 

oh i see what you mean now. open new youth clubs then remove the cameras.

 

your from manchester ??? did you see in your local paper 45 year old woman raped walking home all caught on cctv a local 58 year old scum guy .

 

 

what has that got to do with getting kids off the streets.

[ljarrald 0]

no, not really! nobody has actually requested these... if they kept the youth clubs open then the troublesome kids would be busy in there, not on the streets where the cctv needs to keep an eye on them.

 

 

 

oh i see what you mean now. open new youth clubs then remove the cameras.

 

your from manchester ??? did you see in your local paper 45 year old woman raped walking home all caught on cctv a local 58 year old scum guy .

 

 

what has that got to do with getting kids off the streets.

 

no. not open new ones, don't close down existing ones!

i know lots of scummy kids. when they go to youth clubs they learn how do be normal, yeah it does not really do that much but when they are there they enjoy themselves, stay off the streets and stay out of trouble.

the government has made huge cuts to them forcing alot of them to close, yet they can still afford to shove cctv up where it is not wanted.

 

i did not hear about that rape incident. but whilst the CCTV footage would of helped alot, they could of found the guy without it.

 

like i say, i do not have any problem at all with CCTV that records, is displayed on a live screen for a security guard in a premises to glance at every now and again or they watch in detail (live or recorded) due to an incident.

 

it is when you have a control room with like 50 odd camera feeds and they can watch people moving from one place to another live. one foot out of line and bam, nee noor, nee nor. i am not saying this has happened to me, and yes i am one of many people the cctv looks at so yes, i am being paranoid but i have every right to be until it has been proven to me i do not need to be.

 

also, monitored CCTV in town centers is not really a bad thing, nor is private CCTV in shopping malls as once you leave, they don't know where you are.

its when you walk less than one mile and 98% of your walk is on bloody CCTV. i do not want this, at all.

 

just read that last bit back, i meant 98% is on council cctv. shop cctv and cctv in peoples homes is fine, not got a problem with it!

[Numb-nuts 1]

If some thug had tried to mug you on your way home I think you'd be glad that the cameras were watching so that help could be sent to you very quickly. Thing is what you don't see is that it is likely that no such attack was likely because of CCTV being there.

 

CTV can work both for and against you depending which side of the law you choose.

 

I feel sorry for CCTV operators, their job must be so boring, I fall asleep at my computer frequently. CCTV is the most boring TV with the exception of the occasional action feature.

 

Have you ever watched BIg Brother at night when they are all asleep in bed? Now thats boring!

[Soundy 1]

no, not really! nobody has actually requested these...

How do you know this? Have you asked EVERYBODY?